Settling & Night Feeds
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Topic: Settling & Night Feeds
Posted By: BuzzyBee
Subject: Settling & Night Feeds
Date Posted: 31 December 2007 at 10:46pm
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Just wondering how many of you are still on nightly feeds, and if so how many per night and how old is your bub?
Lucas is still feeding twice nightly, sometimes three. Has done this since he was newborn. Is still breastfed (Wonder if that makes a difference?) ...i recall people telling me it would get better at 3 months and he would sleep through...but he didn't, then they said maybe 6 months....and nope. 9 Months and still no improvements. The broken sleep is killing me. He is also extremely fussy with his solids, only takes puree's generally, sometimes lumpy. Is fine with finger foods (if he likes the taste of them). Some days just won't eat but im putting that down to him teething at present. Also ...settling. How many of you settle your bubs to sleep by breastfeeding? Plunket has told me off several times (depending on which nurse I get, some don't say anything) ...It's a habit we got into and now it can take up to SIX hours to get him to sleep. For instance last nite, 8pm till 2am he just wouldn't sleep. No matter how many times he fed, and how many times I left him in his cot with the light off and door closed....I don't like this controlled crying idea, apart from the fact it NEVER works....never has! I have tried this approach ever since bubs was 3 months. He just gets himself very worked up and it turns into a tantrum where he cries, shakes/trembles and sniffles uncontrollably. I don't care what people say, i don't agree with it. Any ideas on how I can solve this problem of not being able to settle him at night? What do you do? I guess I could also put the latter down to teething also. The broken sleep is seriously killing me though. We were asleep by 9.30pm tonight which is pretty good for bub. Mind you I had bathed him and got him ready by 6pm so still need to improve on the time it takes to get him down. ARGH! ------------- Single Mum to a darling wee boy of 3 years :) |
Replies:
Posted By: Bubbaloo
Date Posted: 31 December 2007 at 10:55pm
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James stopped having night feeds when he was about 6mths but then would still have the occasional feed if he would self settle during the night if he woke up.
I used to feed James till he fell asleep too but would wake him so he was a little dozy so he would know he wasn't on me anymore when I put him down we did the controlled crying thing to get James to self settle it only took on night. He did go through a stage about the some age as Lucas when he was very unsettled I put it down to growth spurt and teething. ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  Was danni-chick Mum to James My Angel 28/07/08 |
Posted By: kebakat
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 7:29am
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Daniel has a routine that goes:
6:30pm bath 7pm put down and goes to sleep in about 5-10 mins - we rarely hear from him 8:30pm dream feed 5:40-6am he wakes up, I give him a feed and pop on white noise and go back to bed (this is new) 7am wakes up for the day I think that Daniel goes to bed so well at night because he has a routine, it never changes and by that I mean that he knows that he has dinner (solids), nappy free time, bath, massage, get dressed, bottle, bed. We also used the sleep easy solution dvd which the sleep store has. We found it really good. Has lots of usuful tips in the dvd and they actually show you what to do with all these different types of babies with different problems right up to a 2 yr old which was really cool. It only took a night or two for their techniques to work for us. |
Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 7:40am
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Routines are the best!
Prob some of you will know about Blake and his trip to Naughty Babies school. It was brilliant. Mum2Lucas...At Mothercraft Unit they believe and stand by the principal that if a baby from 6 months on is getting enough sleep, feeds and Solids by bedtime there is no reason or need they should not sleep from either 6:30 pm or dream feed time til 6 in the morning. And I tell ya it works. Every baby that came in with us that week was reformed when it went out and had gained 300grams or more in 5 days! It does no harm to baby in fact usually makes them very very happy and content. Blake since then has been the most happiest smiley chilled out little boy I could have ever asked for with no feeding or sleeping issues (aside from the odd eating vege issue!!) Blake was doing what Lucas is doing and he was 8 months and I had had enough. I went to Mothercraft who put him into a sleep routine of two sleeps per day - three huge meals of solids and bath and bed at 6:30 and dreamfeed for two nights then the third night he slept through. The night nurse said he woke a few times but was IGNORED as at that age night waking in only ever habit if they are being fed enough during the day. Sounds really strict etc but it works. Its hard to get it into practice at home but totally worth it for the sleep and peace if you can get it sorted. -------------  
 
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Posted By: aimeejoy
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 7:42am
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You could try emailing the sleep expert on here- I know she has helped out a few OB mums. ------------- Aimee Hannah 22/10/05 Greer 11/02/08 |
Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 7:45am
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Oh and one thing about teething I also learnt from Mothercraft...........If teething is bothering baby during the day it will at night but Pamol is enough to dull the pain...however if it is not really causing too much bother it wont be during the night.
And they said the teething pain (ie when tooth is pushing through) that affects babies PER TOOTH lasts average 2-3 days. Thats it!! Amazing aye. Here I was blaming teething for everything under the sun with Paige when she was little so when I heard that...was very interesting!She must have just had sore wee tum! Obviously babies are different like we are...but from the books I read over there and the info from all the nurses..they are not that hard to work out these little people :) -------------
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Posted By: busymum
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 8:04am
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It's a tricky one. Hannah and Briona went from 2 feeds per night to 1, at 6mos but I felt in hindsight that it was more a comfort feed than necessary. Anyway I wasn't strict about it so I continued with that feed until 11mos (both of them) when I weaned them, and the same night they didn't wake for a feed! Briona relapsed at about 7mos back to 2 feeds and then 3 and I thought no way, she's just doing it cause she can, not cause she needs it, so I did CC except for the usual time midnight snack (one only). It was hard - mostly hard for me, but it was what I needed to do. -------------  |
Posted By: NovemberMum
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 8:40am
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I can usually get Megan down about 9:30pm and she will usually wake around 6am. I would put her down earlier but of course it would mean she would wake around 4am.
Megan too is breastfed but she does feed a lot during the day so could be why she sleeps long stretches at night. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Mum2ET
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 9:16am
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Ella goes to bed at 7 every night and settles herself to sleep pretty quickly (we also have a routine during the day which does help her). She has a dream feed around 10- some nights through she doesn't want the feed and still has a night feed at around 2. Wakes up at 6 and then goes back down to sleep again for another hr and starts the morning at 7. I think the middle of the night feed is more out of habit, as she is on 3 solid meals a day...but she doesn't get feed to sleep, as she is always awake when I put her down to bed. There is a book called the no cry sleep solution, which may help if you don't want to do the CIO approach (can get it from the sleep store or could try your local library). Good luck with what ever approach you do decide to do and hope you get more sleep soon ------------- Mum to Ella (5) and Tom (2) |
Posted By: MyMinis
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 11:20am
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routines are great, with haleigh she was to ahrd tog et into one but james fell into one straight away.
because james was bottlefed we been lucky we've had good night sleeps 99% of the time since he was born. we found at night so long as his routine goes, solids, bath/ nonappytime/ playtime, bottle, swaddle babytad and kisses (has to kiss his sister) then hes out like a light till anywhere between 5 - 630am lately. i did the controlled crying with haleigh and it took 2wks tog et it to work with her, ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
http://tweetytweety85.bebo.com - bebo |
Posted By: miss
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 12:10pm
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Not any advice here, but I wanted tos ay that some babies simply can't do CIO. Lily can't , if she is so upset that she won't get past a grizzle in 5 minutes then she will go like your bubba, screaming shaking and it can take an hour to settle her down. needless to say we have made the decision to not do that anymore.
We can sometimes settle her by rocking in her bed, or by cuddles, but often at night we need to go the booie way. She can put herself to sleep no worries during the day though so i am not worried about that yet. Good luck, I hope you find somehting that works for you. one thing I have read a bit lately re the constant night feeding is to get your partner to settle for one f the night feeds and to give a bottle - you could start with EBM then move to water, so he isn't getting you all the time? -------------  
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Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 1:53pm
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I wish it was that simple, im a solo Mum (living with parents) and Lucas doesn't take from a bottle, nor do I expect my parents to get up and help me out.l
This sleep store that you have mentioned a couple of times ...is it online? I haven't heard of this place before! I do feel that it is the solids that may be the reason why he isn't settling at night. He has never been big on them and still only has a 4-6month sized jar at one feed. He is a big boy though, always has been and is putting on weight constantly. I think I might sit down and write out a routine and take some pointers from Kelpa and her Mothercraft Unit experience! I already have the basic routine of feed play breastfeed sleep ...2 sleeps per day and then after his tea around 6.30pm its bath time, then play breastfeed sleep. I just need to figure out when i breastfeed him now if I don't want to breastfeed him to sleep ....and don't want to fill him up before his solids. How do you get a child to eat their food if they constantly clamp their mouth shut? I do really believe it goes back to solids... I have had enough....I want a decent nights sleep again! ------------- Single Mum to a darling wee boy of 3 years :) |
Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 2:33pm
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Okay..here is the routine I got given for 8month old Blake..pretty much............ I did post it on here ages ago but have no idea where.
Blake did not ever take a bottle either and never has drunk any milk. Has rice milk in his cereal and custard- thats it! Are you giving him solids first..as from 8 months it is solids first??? So bearing in mind baby at this age should still only be up for a max of two hours to inc all feeding play etc. 6-7am - wake up- change bum- big bowl of solids plus piece of toast - then within the hour a FULL breastfeed from both sides. Play. 8-30 -9am Back to bed for sleep (aiming for at least 1.5-2hours) 11am -12 wake up change bum etc..big bowl of solids then sandwich then full b/f on both sides within the hour..... play play play........ 2ish back down for afternoon nap........ 4 -4-30ish play dinner of solids and big custard or some yoghurt etc finger food to chew on then you can either do full b/f then bath or bath then feed straight before bed..... 9:30....very quiet dream feed no lights no contact just in and out and back down....try that for 3 nights then dont wake for dream feed. If bubs wakes in the night wait a good 15 minutes before going in and patting and wrapping - saying SHHH and walk out. Honest it wont take long for him to get the picture that night is for sleeping and day is for eating and sleeping and play!!! PM me if you want to.... :o) -------------
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 2:37pm
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P.s...honestly sounds like he is overtired...overstimulated and just cant get relaxed enough to get into deep sleep and eating habits properly....so Mum needs to lead the way....
Its tough but my God the kind of baby you get thats big, bonny and healthy and no sleep problems and they learn to love there beds...its wonderful :) I remember my Mum (Karitane nurse) saying to me a long time ago before I had Paige that babies need sleep to be able to eat and grow. They grow when they sleep so a baby that is constantly awake and has no guidelines or routines will have trouble doing any of that..... -------------
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Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 2:50pm
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Thank you sooo much for all that, Im going to print it out & give it a try for the next few days starting tomorrow. Im guessing it might take a couple of days before he adheres to the routine and eats his food properly?
And how do you put them down to sleep if they keep jumping up and walking around the cot? Thats why i always end up resorting to breastfeeding him to sleep to try and settle him because he makes it impossible otherwise! And if he won't take the solids i offer him....then what? ------------- Single Mum to a darling wee boy of 3 years :) |
Posted By: MyMinis
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 4:30pm
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i just used to let haleigh jump and walk around her cot, she would eventually give up in the end. dont think theres much in the way of keeping a moving bub still.
even james crawls around his cot and i swaddle him real tight and pin him down with blankets lol. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
http://lilypie.com">
http://tweetytweety85.bebo.com - bebo |
Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 6:41pm
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Ah............forgot about that......... well I wasnt using a safety sleep before going to Mothercraft but they use them and insist on them there and it was a godsend. They say it makes them feel secure - stops them banging heads on cots etc so waking unnecessarily etc. I know lots of people dont use them but I will be for next one as it was great for Blake and had I started earlier with Paige would have been great to keep her in - not that she was ever bad sleeper! Terribly ahead of herself to the point we ended up having to lock her in her room as she would climb out of her cot at 9 months and end up asleep on the floor. She would fall asleep on her teddies etc too!! (really funny)
Blake only came out of it in the last month and has been nodding off in some odd positions but all good. Yes it could take up to a week with perserverance...could only take 3 nights too :) -------------
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 6:45pm
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I think if solids are the first thing he is offered when he is really hungry before any feeds and make it things like Custards and banana or yoghurt for lunches etc to get him going and enjoying "eating" then do big cook ups of mashed veges with gravy...Im sure he will suprise you after a few days of getting into the swing of it :) HE IS A BOY HE HE
I could not beleive what Blake ate..Here I was giving him one boring jar of apples or that pureed cereal (tiny amounts) and when he got the big nosh ups they made there with gravy and chicken mince etc - he was in his element!!!! Like a dessert bowl full!!!! -------------
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 6:46pm
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Oh and I did exactly what you were doing - b/f to keep the peace with all the rest of the house.....It was the first thing they said was going to stop.....LOL -------------
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Posted By: 3boys
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 7:52pm
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Mum2Lucas - it does get really tiring!!!
My baby wakes at least two times a night and does take time to settle in the evenings - we too do the bath, wrap, BF routine, but it still takes a little time. We are a little different and don't do the CIO method or the strict routines that some other parents use. My first two babies learnt to love their beds and sleep really well but it takes time. They are so young and all they want is you! I know this is hard when you are a solo mum - have been there. I have a sling and rock and feed my baby to sleep and I don't feel bad about it. I also feed him as many times as he wakes int he night. I can hear some people saying arrrrggggghhhh  Coehn goes to sleep in his own bed in the evening and when he wakes in the night I plop him next to me (have a safety rail) and feed him whenever he cries - I always fall asleep and so does he.
Try the different methods and you will find one that works for you. Try to remember that he is just a normal healthy baby and nothing is wrong with what he is doing. Re: Solids before BF. I would try to give them at separate times (in between BF) to make the transition from BF before solids to after smoother for him, as switching so suddenly may be difficult for him as it sounds as though he is a little bit sensitive with solid foods. Quinn was very much like that. Good Luck! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 8:56pm
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hey babe...was just thinking also..Mothercraft have some great handouts etc and I can tell you 100% that what they do works hence why passing on the info!! I wouldnt recommend it if I didnt believe in it! Thats why they have it and its so hard to get in to!!! There are others on here who have been and have had beautiful sleeping eating Under one year olds!!
They are at Waikato Hospital and possibly you could go??? Get Plunket or Doc to refer you if really having troubles. It is great. They are all highly trained Paed nurses, Karitane nurses and Plunket nurses and a few Midwives :) I cant recommend it highly enough. -------------
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 9:00pm
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Re keeping meals and b/f in the hour. It is done for three purposes.
1. To teach baby that Mum is not and open smorgasboard all day long at 6 months and older. 2. They get better amount and quality of milk to satisfy them and help sleep longer fomr you with bigger and fewer feeds. 3. Having grazing all day long - ie leaving time between solids and b/f milk feeds can cause unsettledness and unrest due to having trouble constantly digesting food.... (as they got into toddler stage that all changes as they have morning and afternoon tea etc) ANYWAY I have probably overloaded you now so will SHUT UP!!! LOL! Lets know how you get on. -------------
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Posted By: susieq
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 9:05pm
| They need mothercraft units in every city speaking as an ex karitane |
Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 01 January 2008 at 9:36pm
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Yeah I actually googled mothercraft after you had mentioned it earlier Kelpa, I was a bit disheartened to see that there was only the one in Waikato, and even moreso that it was at a hospital! (Major fear of hospitals here, only went to one to have a baby & when I was suffering an anaphylactic attack from my severe allergies). Showed Mum & she told me I was being silly & that Lucas was not in dire need of help enough to travel that far or go to something like that & that the problem with his eating and settling at night can be solved with strict routine. BUT will definitely be incorporating all those tips you have given me from Mothercraft experience. We generally do eat solids before breastfeeds and top him up with breastmilk around half an hour after his feed. Most the time after he has put up a huge fight with solids, he just isn't interested in the breast & would rather go off and play!
So new year and all that, gonna make lots of changes and try out several routines until i find one that works. I mean we have a routine as such, just obviously needs adjusting! He likes vanilla custard ....and the strawberry and banana one, and the pureed jars of 'parsnip, carrots, kumara' ...and he LOVES his wiggly cheesy breadsticks and being giving little blocks of colby cheese to hold & eat. Marmite sandwhichs don't seem to be going down so well with him lately, and the minute i introduce chunky solids it all goes out the window! He can eat it perfectly fine, he takes around 6 spoonfuls and then will clamp his mouth shut. Rather frustrating! Maybe I should try give him his own spoon to hold, when are they capable of self feeding? I find Plunket not very helpful ...When I need them the most they are never there and my nurse is quite aware of the troubles we have had with introducing solids ...has been this way ever since 5 months...on/off them every week! Now we don't see her again till one year and i have no idea if he is putting on weight or losing it, because even his breastfeeds seem to be lessening! Thank you all for your advice, im writing up a new routine as we speak and will spend the next few days/weeks TRYING to put it in place and adjusting it where need be! Oh and good news, he was in bed and asleep at 8.30 pm tonight guys - touch wood!!!  ------------- Single Mum to a darling wee boy of 3 years :) |