Formula top-ups
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Category: General Chat
Forum Name: General Chat
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URL: https://www.ohbaby.co.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=17320
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Topic: Formula top-ups
Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Subject: Formula top-ups
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 12:07pm
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After a week of waking at 1:30 and 5 for feeds I'm exhausted and looking for ways to help my baby sleep through the night!
She's always been a once a night girl, right from the start. Our night time routine is fairly standard. Play, bath, massage, feed, bed. DH bottle feeds her EBM. I express while he does this, ready for her dinner the following night. I'm only managing to express about 125mls (I used to be able to get a good 180mls). What did others do at 4 months old in terms of feeding? I've read a lot of you do formula top ups. What's the average amount your baby ate at this stage? Did formula help them sleep through longer? I'm at my wits end, and I have it relatively easy, compared to some. You all deserve medals!! Oh, and what's your favourite formula? And why? ------------- 
http://lilypie.com">  
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Replies:
Posted By: popcorn
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 12:26pm
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she might be going through a growth spurt so she may be trying to increase your supply, you could try expressing in the morning and feeding her the morning milk at night as it tends to be fattier and more satisfying at that time of day, i know lots of people that worked for.
I started my boy on solids about 4 months, he was starving and feeding 2 hourly through the day plus all the usual signs so didnt end up needing formula till 6 months when my milk started to dry up and he started to bite me! We use Heinz Nurture, I like it because its cheap, its thinner than other formulas so more alike to breast milk ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Freesia
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 12:42pm
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Charly, you pretty much know our story and that Livvy isn't a great feeder. We give Livvy a couple formula feeds at night every hour or so (because she won't take enough in one feed) but she's still waking once a night. Better that than the 3 times we get without the formula. In total the feed would amount to about 200ml - sometimes a little bit more.
We use the Heinz Nuture Gold purely because of all the sample packs we had, that was the only one she'd actually drink  Hope you find something that works so that Hannah sleeps a little better.-------------  
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Posted By: Maya
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 1:04pm
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Gremlins were fully FF by 3 mths, and no it didn't help them sleep thru the night.
Maya started night waking at 16 weeks and Plunket told me to put her on solids, which I did and it was a huge mistake and didn't fix her sleep at all. Sorry, not much help here  -------------  Maya Grace (28/02/03)
 (02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
Lil miss:Chiara Louise Chloe (09/07/08)
Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 1:35pm
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That's OK Emma! I wanna hear all sides and all successes and failures with formula top-ups.
I want to make an informed decision 
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http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 1:36pm
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I guess my questions is; is 125mls enough at night for a 4 month old? -------------
http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: SMoody
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 1:52pm
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McKayla was breastfeeding for ten minutes at a time every 3 hours during the day and 4 hours at night. We did demandfeeding but she just got herself into that schedule. We only started feeding solids at 4 and a half months and that was due to her grabbing food out of my hand and feeding herself (otherwise I would have waited a bit longer)
I tried top up feeding for a week when she was 11 months old (we moved her so day and night literally changed and she started feeding more at night)Didnt help one bit but that was just my experience. She did throw the bottle at me however the first two night and after that drank it but got up more or less the same time. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: tishy
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 2:15pm
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My 2 are putting away 200mils of EBM each at the 10pm dreamfeed. No idea where they're putting it to be honest.
There's a formula that can be used to calculate how much milk you should be giving but I can't remember it properly. Something like (200*weight)/num feeds. Someone correct me if that's wrong. I express immediately after and have found that I'm not getting as much milk now that they're sleeping through the night. We're currently digging into the supply in the freezer but I've started expressing in the morning as well in the hope that it'll increase the supply. |
Posted By: BellaBoo
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 2:58pm
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Hmmm....it dosnt sound like enough to me. Bella was downing 200-250mls EBM at that age.
I was also doing the expressing while DF feeds but got sick of doing that. Now I let Bella drain my boobs before her bath and then give her as much formula as she will take (usually up to 80mls) after her bath and then she goes straight to bed. This has been sooooo much easier, less stressful and far less time consuming. You could try this but keep expressing to keep your supply up just in case it dosnt work for you? Good Luck! ------------- http://lilypie.com">   http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Freesia
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 3:18pm
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Charly, it would probably depend on how many times Hannah is feeding during the day. She may have little bits more often. I posted the formula Tishy was talking about on another thread. My midwife gave it to me when I asked how much EBM to feed at each sitting.
Basically take babies weight (kg) x 200 and that gives you how many mls they 'should' drink in the day and then divide that by the number of feeds they have during the day to give you an amount of how much to give at each feed. Eg, if baby weighs 5.5kg and has 6 feeds a day, you go 5.5x200=1100 ml per day -> 1100/6=183mls each feed. The 200 figure was the maximum. My midwife said to use a figure between 180-200 depending on the baby. -------------
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 4:18pm
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I am the same as Maya. My wee man is fully FF (always has been) and started solids at 4 months and he is only just sleeping thru. So am not sure that formula or solids makes a huge difference.
He was waking at roughly the same times as Hannah and I just stopped feeding him at the early wake to see if he would go back to sleep without it and he did. Could be worth a try. Mac has 200mls at 7pm and goes down then. -------------  
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Posted By: arohanui
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 4:26pm
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Hey Charly, I've been the same where my supply was getting low in the evenings. For the last few days I've been taking Fennel (does the same thing as Blessed Thistle apparently, but the shop didn't have any when DH bought it) and I've certainly noticed a big increase in my supply. It's great.
Just another thought - how many feeds is Hannah getting during the day? I find that if I fit 6 feeds in, that helps Harry to get through the night easier. Also what time does she go to bed? When Harry started randomly doing the twice a night thing, I pushed his bedtime later again (about 9/10pm) and found that helped. Also I keep him up for at least 2 hours before bed... at the moment actually it's more like 3 hours. Just distract him with playing in exersaucer, sitting in highchair, nudey time etc.. and then his bath or shower and massage. Sometimes he does get grizzly but if it gets too bad I'll give him his dummy (doesn't usually have it for when he's awake). I just find it's worth it cos he sleeps for longer at night. I dunno, just some ideas anyway cos I feel for you!  ------------- Mama to DS1 (5 years), DS2 (3 years) and... http://alterna-tickers.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 4:42pm
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Thanks everyone
I've done that calculation, thanks Freesia! According that that I should be feeding her 180-200mls at each feed. I know if I express around 11am I'll get a good 180mls. I expressed after her 11am feed today (after she had both sides for a good 3-4 mins each) and I got a fursther 40mls, so I'd say it's just my night time supply that's lacking. I bought a couple of the Nurture Gold single serve sachets today to trial. Will see how it goes. I'll pop up to the health shop on Monday to look into fennel or blessed thistle. 
Hannah's not ready for solids. She doesn't show ANY interest in when we eat or any of the other classic signs. -------------
http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: ElfsMum
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 5:01pm
sorry to thread jack but help me here.. Ethan has 150 mls per feed..any more and he wont feed properly next one (say will do 180 then 60) and it is the rigth amount for him..he is putting on weight(has doubled birth weight) is happy and healthy and not dehydrated..but going by that formula he'd need (he's 6.4kg) a lot more than he gets per day..I'm sure the nurse told me 600+ was ok.. he feeds three hourly during the day and once a night.. ------------- Mum to two amazing boys! |
Freesia wrote:Posted By: .Mel
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 5:52pm
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Charly what do you class as "sleeping thru"?
What time is she going to bed? When she wakes at 5 what time does she wake up after that feed? I'd also suggest that you buy Complan and drink that and blend in a banana that will help with your supply too. Also just a friendly warning, if you start with formula topups make sure that you express while she's having that formula bottle, sometimes topping up can be the slippery slope to weaning (not all cases, but it can happen). ------------- Mr Mellow (16) Miss Attitude (8) Destructa Kid (3) 
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Posted By: Tiff
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 5:54pm
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I try to work it on how much Rohann has in a 24hr period not each individual feed. Oh and I was told similar to Freesia except you could go as little as 120 - 200 per kg. As for some reason, although Rohann is a big girl she's not a big eater - I also find she eats differing amount at different times (ie more in late afternoon through to early morning and then less after that). ------------- http://lilypie.com">  
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Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 6:16pm
Thanks hun
I always express while DH feeds her the EBM I expressed from the night before, so I'll still be expressing so he can have his Daddy/Daughter time
And sleeping through to me is until 6 - bed at 8:30. I'm happy if she goes until 5, as she'll go down for another couple of hours. But Up at 6 is, to me, a reasonable time to start my day
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Posted By: Freesia
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 7:00pm
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KA, because Ethan is FF that might be different? I don't know about the specifics, I just wanted a general idea about how much to offer and that's what my midwife told me and it was only referring to EBM. I just liked it because it gave you some idea of what to offer.
Livvy never drinks the same amount and like Ethan, she can have a lot at one feed and then not much at the next. They have a guide on how much to give on the formula tin we have, has your's got that on it too? -------------
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Posted By: fattartsrock
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 7:16pm
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Honestly, it probably won't make much of a difference. Both my kids are sh*t sleepers, and I heard the whole last feed a formula feed theory with Jake and it did not work one bit. It may work for some, but I think it is more luck than anything.
Trust me, if she is going to sleep though, she will sleep through. Developmenally there is a big growth sprut about now, plus other things going on, such as teeth moving around and develping awareness of surroundings and difference of day and night and becoming more social, so these all contribute to night waking. Some kids sleep though from 6 weeks, others sre still waking nightly at 3, and that is more common than you might think, and yes, it does suck! Annd I agreee with mel in regards to pumping to keep your supply up if you drop a b/f for a f/f. ------------- The Honest Un PC Parent of 2, usually stuck in the naughty corner! :P |
Posted By: fattartsrock
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 7:17pm
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And eat a big handful of nuts to help make more milk! ------------- The Honest Un PC Parent of 2, usually stuck in the naughty corner! :P |
Posted By: .Mel
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 7:32pm
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Ok one thing that you may need to change in your thinking is "sleeping thru" for babies is actually only 5 hours!! I've read this in a number of books and when we were having sleep therapy with Cooper she told us the same thing.
Oh yeah def stock up on the nuts. ------------- Mr Mellow (16) Miss Attitude (8) Destructa Kid (3)
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Posted By: ElfsMum
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 7:35pm
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yep- nurse told me about a million times that Ethan was 'sleeping through' by 4 weeks..cause he can do 5 hours...booo!!:( my definition is more like Charly's but Ethan only up once a night on good nights (with the ocassional sleep through and she said he's very normal:( something like only half of babies sleep 8 hour stretches at 3-6 months:(
freesia thanks for clarifying:) ------------- Mum to two amazing boys! |
Posted By: lilfatty
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 8:34pm
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Ive found that if we give Issy a ff last thing she sleeps longer. It could be a complete coincidence, but the couple of times I tried to bf her before bed she woke at 1am looking for more food. Since she sleeps through till 5-6am on a bottle Im not playing around with it!
We have also found that she will go back to sleep quicker if she stirs if DH deals to her as she doesnt see him as a "milk bar" .. so is happy to take a dummy of him and go back to sleep....maybe you could see if DH will try to settle her first to see if she really is hungry. Oh and we use Nuture Gold as I was told it was like breast milk in consistency. ------------- Mummy to Issy (3) and Elias (18 months) I did it .. 41 kgs gone! From flab to fab in under a year  http://www.femininefitness.co.nz/category/blog - LFs weight blog
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Posted By: meow
Date Posted: 17 May 2008 at 10:54pm
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Growth spurts happen every few weeks, then months - and last for a week or so. I don't remember when it was, but we once went through a feeding frenzy that drove me mad and I considered formula, but I stuck through it and it was only a week and a half - was glad I didn't change anything as she started feeding less often again.
Just because they have been sleeping through doesn't mean that they are always going to sleep through, every night. Growth spurts, sickness, all sorts of things come into play and you will have to put up with waking every so often - it sucks, but that comes with having a baby  ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Snickerdoodle
Date Posted: 18 May 2008 at 8:09am
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nuts, bananas, complan.... *adds to shopping list*
Thanks everyone! Yeah, the 5 hour thing seems to be classed as "sleeping through". She's always done that, so I'd like her to go longer. HOWEVER. We tried formula last night, what a bust. She had 140mls of EBM, bath, massage then we tried her with the formula. Nope. Wasn't having a bar of it. I was expressing while DH was trying her on the formula so we did a swap-out. She took a whole 5mls of EBM before grizzling, so I think she was full. She had about 10mls of formula (VERY grudgingly). So she had about 155mls all up and slept from 8:15pm until 6am! YAY! I slept from 9pm until 6. I feel AWESOME!! I can handle the sh*tty nights better if she can give me the odd great night. Thanks for all your advice. I think I'll ditch the formula for a while and just give her 11am milk for her 7:30pm feed. Seemed to do the trick, or at least she seemed to eat more of it
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http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: jack_&_charli
Date Posted: 18 May 2008 at 8:52am
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i haven't read the other posts so i may be repeating....
when i was having supply struggles with charli, my mw suggested a banana smoothie made with complan everyday...yum! but we did give her a formula top-up from about 8wks as i just didn't have enough there at the end of a busy day for her to get through the night. she did start to sleep longer and was sleeping through from 10wks...7pm-7.30am but she could be going through a growth spurt too.... formula....we always used karicare because when we did use nurture, when they (both kids) spilled, it was the consistency of cottage cheese  but that's a personal preference, if you do decide to use formula, try a few sample packs of each brand first and see what works best------------- http://www.alternatickers.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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