attachment parenting...
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Printed Date: 09 October 2025 at 2:11am
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Topic: attachment parenting...
Posted By: gypsynita
Subject: attachment parenting...
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 9:51pm
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is anyone watching this on Real Life (TV1)?? I'm a little disturbed... ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com"> 
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Replies:
Posted By: .Mel
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 9:54pm
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I'm recording it, I didn't think DH would want to watch it when Sportscafe is back on. ------------- Mr Mellow (16) Miss Attitude (8) Destructa Kid (3) 
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Posted By: Neeks
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 9:56pm
I'm not a little disturbed... I'm ALOT disturbed LOL  -------------  
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Posted By: Kellz
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 9:56pm
| DH is watching sports cafe too,...but the adds were enough to put me off watching it! |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:00pm
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i forgot that was on - is it a repeat? ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker"> 
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Posted By: Neeks
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:03pm
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I don't think it's a repeat (at least i haven't seen it) -------------
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Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:04pm
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don't know if it's a repeat or not -- i definately haven't seen it before!!
I've got no problems with the theory - ie: staying close to your child, blah blah - but breastfeeding till they're 8 years old????!! and the kids on the show just seem really really spoilt to me so can't see how it's working! ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Neeks
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:05pm
OMG 8 years old??? EWWW that's just wrong!!!!!! I thought the little girl at 5 was bad enough  -------------
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Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:06pm
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Yeah I'm watching and I'm VERY disturbed too... by the breastfeeding to that age not the theory of it...
DP changed the channel... phew! lol ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
Posted By: fairsk8
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:07pm
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Yip watching it. I am finding it interesting but now it is starting to get a little disturbing with the toileting. ------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com/"> 
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Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:08pm
when they broke out the "ultimate chick flick" DH practically ran out of the room!! LOL  ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:09pm
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Lol yeah classic, what was happening with the toileting?
My partner won't let me turn it back now lol ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:11pm
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they don't beleive in nappies... so basically potty training from birth but with no back-up. one of the kids just went on the floor and then walked all through it - and the mum was just like "oh no you poo'ed on the floor, well next time do it in the potty" ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: fairsk8
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:12pm
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No nappies. Sing to the child or give them a noise that tells them when it is time to go toilet. She takes her child to the toilet up to 30 times a day. And it is not necessarily a toilet, in the garden will do. Then the boy pooed on the floor and she was saying 'Yay you pooed on the floor." She was super excited about it. I tell you, I would not be that excited if my son pooed on the floor and all down the backs of his legs and his feet.
------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com/">
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Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:13pm
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not to mention trekking it all through the dining room!!! ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: fairsk8
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:13pm
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Snap Anita ------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com/">
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Posted By: fairsk8
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:14pm
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It was the kitchen wasn"t it? ------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com/">
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Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:15pm
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OMG ahhh yuck ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
Posted By: yummymummy
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:16pm
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I'm getting disturbed just reading about it - poos in the the dining room and b'feeding at 8 - ewwww ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:16pm
lol 
what got me was how they'd rather have sex while their 2 year old is in the bed with them, rather than make the kid sleep in it's own bed before it's "ready"... call me selfish... ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: fairsk8
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:18pm
Yeah they go somewhere else to have sex or do it very carefully ------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com/">
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Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:20pm
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I know! I caught that bit just before the channel was changed... that's a bit disturbing for the poor child!
Although if they are brought up to poo in the garden and on the floor then maybe they'll thinking mummy and daddy having specials cuddles right next to them is normal too ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
Posted By: AliaDawn
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:24pm
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I wouldn't be so nasty with the judgements guys - I'm sure there are a few OBers out there who are at least into co-sleeping, and maybe someone who does EC/extended breastfeeding. Each to their own I say, but the constant negative attitudes aren't very nice!
And to all the comments about ECing (elimination communication, aka early TTing) that is the SAME thing that could happen with a TTing toddler, or even a non TT babe who was just having nappy off time, you have to learn to live with a little poo on the floor once in a while if you choose to have kids. I haven't seen that doco, but take what you see on tv with a grain of salt... often it's exaggerated etc. -------------  
 
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Posted By: sadie
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:30pm
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I'm all for people doing what they think is best, but I can't help wondering how these parenting styles are going to impact on the kids as they get older.
Are we not meant to raise our children to be independent and secure in themselves? How will that happen if they are not allowed to be away from a parent for more than an hour or two at a time? Funny how all the DH's are refusing to watch - mine left the room 10 minutes into the programme! |
Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:32pm
My thinking exactly  ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
potato wrote:Posted By: sadie
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:34pm
| Oh and did anyone else notice that the breastfeeding mum keeps banging on about the amazing benefits of breast milk, but then it showed her kids drinking cans of 7Up? |
Posted By: VioletStar
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:36pm
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Lol no I didn't pick up on that, far out ------------- Formerly Wishin41 |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:37pm
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that husbands funny, hes just stirring!!! ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker">
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Posted By: Jennz
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 10:48pm
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Urgh I hate it when they show those extremes- I really like alot of the ideas of attachment parenting, but then they show programmes like that with people who take the theories to the extreme and then everyone winds up linking 'attachment parenting' with wishy washy hippies and don't look into some of the wonderful theories behind it. The main principles are:
1. Preparation for Pregnancy, Birth and Parenting 2. Feed with Love and Respect 3. Respond with Sensitivity 4. Use Nurturing Touch 5. Engage in Nighttime Parenting 6. Provide Consistent Loving Care 7. Practice Positive Discipline 8. Strive for Balance in Personal and Family Life I don't know about you guys but I think those sounds like a pretty nice guide to base your parenting philosophy on! Its up to the parent on how they interpret those guidelines. I took alot of the ideas of attachment parenting on board with Kate- we co slept until both of us were ready to have her move into another room, I breast fed on demand, I am totally anti CIO or CC and never did it with either of my girls, I had her on me in a sling and rocked her to sleep as a baby and we never use physical discipline. If anything I think it has helped her be independent and secure as I met her needs asap as I was always right there- so she has the confidence that that kind of security brings, shes not clingy as she doesn't need to be. But then again, maybe I'm just 'lucky' and both my girls would have been a good sleepers and a confident happy children no matter what we did. ------------- Jen, Charlotte 7 & Kate 3 
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Posted By: Bel
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 11:02pm
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DH, mum and I just sat and watched - made for very interesting conversation and discussion. I don't disagree with any of the things they were doing, I just know that I couldn;t do it myself... I applaud them for doing it, they honestly believe that they are doing the absolute best for their children - as I believe that I am doing the best for my child with the way I am bringing him up... They didn't convert me at all but it was very interesting watching... ------------- Mum to two beautiful kids 
Luke (09.11.2007) Amy (01.04.2009) |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 09 July 2008 at 11:08pm
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How long were they planning on breastfeeding for ? did they say ? til they were 10? 13? 16? , because quite frankly that starts to seem a bit , incestuous.
And if thats too un PC, then bugger it , im sick of being PC. I wouldnt be thrilled if my child purposely went toilet anywhere, if they knew better, its different when they are still learning . I think a lot of the ideas of attachment parenting are good, but i guess in every situation , there are people who want to take it to the extreme...besides , the extreme ones make more interesting tv ..... |
Posted By: Mikaela
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 8:38am
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I knew a family who did the more extreme form of attachment parenting for their three kids, and I have to say that those children were the most - this is awful - unlikeable kids I've ever met. They were demanding, spoilt, rude and just unpleasant to be around. Their kids all breastfed til they were four-ish and co-slept for about the same length of time, which meant that at one stage the parents must have been co-sleeping all three of them.
Anyway, I tend to think that attachment parenting is like anything else - in moderation and done with common sense it's fine, but if you go to extremes then things start to get a bit wrong. The same could be said of any parenting 'method'. ------------- http://www.bump-and-beyond.com"> 
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Posted By: susieq
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 8:54am
| I was disturbed by what I saw of it when i got home |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 8:57am
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mikaela i think the whole concept of attachment parenting tho is its a boots and all approach, not something that is done in moderation, or half pie. I dont think too that all parents who are into attachment parenting do all of the things from the show last night.
kelly thats funny... too PC??? dont think so.
a child would not be breastfeeding at 10, 13, 16 because they would choose to stop before that age. ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker">
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:02am
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AliaDawn - I don't think the comments people are making are nasty - its just expressing opinions. I think any parent who goes against "the norm' (whatever that is) is going to be prepared for comments and opinions and they are usually confident in their decisions anyway.
I found it quite interesting but was looking for a little more research on how it affects the kids in the long run. I was kinda disturbed that they had sex with the child in bed with them...esp as the child was 2 and could very easily be aware of what was going on. Also found it interesting that the lady that was feeding the 4 year old had actually stopped feeding her but started again when she had the youngest child. -------------  
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Posted By: AliaDawn
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:21am
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Personally I'm not into extended breastfeeding, but I do understand those who are - hoping to bf this bub till it's 2 - 1/2, or when it wants to stop. And if I have enough milk, I will definately not be against expressing some for Seb to drink in a cup. Human milk is made for humans, cows milk is made for cows... it's pretty simple which is best for humans!
As for the "sex in bed with kids" thing, I know people who do co-sleep, and would do that, but the kid would be asleep, and others who would go have sex elsewhere (the couch etc). Sex is taboo in our culture... that doesn't mean it was always this way, or that it's "wrong" it just means it's not the norm... What I find nasty is the reactions like "gross" you can say "I don't agree with it and this is why" without adding things like that. I would be mortified if I said something like that and then someone who did one of those things came and read it! -------------
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Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:08am
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AliaDawn - I totally know what you're saying and agree that it is each to their own... like others have said I quite like some of the theories behind attachment parenting and will probably use some of them to an extent - but the people on that show last night (i felt) took it too far.
As for the breastfeeding bit - there's a big difference between a 2 year old breastfeeding and a 5-8 year old breastfeeding!! by all means express the milk for them to drink in more conventional ways, but even the mother admitted she wouldn't breastfeed her 4 year old in public... ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:33am
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Why is breastfeeding an 8 year old so gross?
Let me guess because society has gotten so obssesssed with boobs equalling sex. Boobs are there to feed humans like they have been doing for thousands and thousands of years. If the kid wants to continue then its better it drinks breast milk than cows milk. It is a known FACT that breast milk has huge benefits at any age for both mum and child. It kinda makes me laugh how people can say all these things about extended breastfeeding (selfish, gross etc) but then get all defensive if anyone dare say anything about formula. I follow my instincts and what humans have been doing for years and years (way before playboy came out) |
Posted By: nuttymama
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:38am
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I'm like peanut I would have like to see how this affected the kids in the long run. I was also quite surprised that the mother had stopped breastfeeding and then started again.
Each to their own I guess but as far as the comments about people being nasty, I guess it goes both ways one of the mothers last night was making very derogatory comments about cots and especially bouncers and parents who chose to use prams even. Unfortunately we now live in a society where not everyone can commit themselves to their child 24 hours a day 7 days a week. Several of those women stood up and said they were right and everyone else was wrong so when you are willing to do that you are opening yourself to criticism. As I said each to their own, I don't think any parenting style is a one fits all. Personally I found some it it hard to swallow though. ------------- Abigail 06/01/2005 Jayden 21/11/2001 Micheal 03/04/1997 |
Posted By: KiwiWonder
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:43am
Thank you Alia. I watched it and to be honest I don't see anything wrong with it. In actual fact I do about 90% of the stuff they do (I've never called myself an Attachment Parent, but I guess I could). I co-sleep (albiet with my 3 month old, not the toddler ) because so far that's the best way I've found for us both to get decent sleep - if she stirs and needs a pacifier I can just pop it in her mouth while half asleep, vs. getting up and finding wherever she's rolled onto it in the hammock, then putting it back in her mouth, then getting back in bed. If she needs a feed I'm right there ready for her as well.
Currently I cloth-nappy but I've given EC a good hard look and have every intention of doing it (part time) with K. I wouldn't do it when out and about (as I don't really see the point on making things harder than they need to be) but if I can get K to have a preference for not sitting in a wet / dirty nappy, what's the harm in that? And furthermore I'd rather my 5 year old be drinking milk made to grow strong, healthy, and intelligent humans rather than nice hearty calves any day. I also don't see anything wrong with having special cuddles with a sleeping baby / toddler in the room. It's not like they're involving them at all - and really it's only in Western Society, and in the most recent centuries, that families could afford to have separate rooms for kids / adults - for the vast majority of cultures and the vast majority of history, people shared rooms and sex was just a part of life, vs a totally taboo and absued topic it is now. The only part of the doco I had any problems with was the "preachiness" of it. This is the way I parent - but I'm not about to say that everyone should do it this way. I think every family should decide their own parenting style as long as it's not abusive etc. ------------- Margo |
Posted By: KiwiWonder
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:50am
I find it disturbing that people think 2 year olds know all about the birds and the bees! Certainly I haven't had that talk yet with my nearly-two year old. Personally I remember having an innocence about that sort of thing until at least 5 or 6, but hey, maybe those are "the good old days" ------------- Margo |
Posted By: gypsynita
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 10:56am
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fair enough -- and I apologise if I've caused any offence...
I certainly didn't mean to criticise anyone's way of parenting, just expressing my opinion. As nuttymama so rightly pointed out - the opinions expressed on the show were quite derogatory towards people using methods other than attachment parenting, but it won't stop me from putting my child in a cot "jail". But then the point of these shows is to get people talking about different options so it's been quite successful really
ETA cause i can't spell!! ------------- Anita Mum to Cian (Aug 08), Josh (Jun 10) http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Bel
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 11:04am
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Yeah my DH got a bit het up about a few of the things the ladies were saying and I had to keep reminding him that the show was showing ONE way of parenting, it was not designed to be impartial, they were only rude about the "normal" parenting in the way that everyone here is commenting that what they do is wrong. Interesting that I am still posting, I am not interested in attachment parenting myself, but think it is an interesting idea... ------------- Mum to two beautiful kids
Luke (09.11.2007) Amy (01.04.2009) |
Posted By: AliaDawn
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 11:07am
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I would just try not to stoop to the level of those on the show. If they were offending you, I'd think that would be the last thing you'd want to do! They tend to pick the most outrageous types they can get their hands on for these types of shows... I would be surprised if most people who followed attachment parenting were that pushy and offensive. The ones I know certainly aren't! -------------
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 12:17pm
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AliaDawn - this is what a progamme like that is for to generate discussion like we are having now. I am sure no one here is drawing conclusions that all people are one way or another. Everyone is alllowed an opinion and the joy of this forum is that no one has the same one.
Kiwiwonder - I should clarify my statement a wee bit as I didn't mean that they would know what sex was etc but can't say that I would be stoked if my 2 year old woke to find us in the middle of special cuddles right next to them... -------------
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Posted By: SMoody
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 12:31pm
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Grant actually called me to come and watch the show and he definately think the hubby was just stirring. Each to our own I say.
As for us. We are co-sleeping. And yes we will do that until McKayla is totally ready to let go. Some nights she wants to sleep in her own bed and once she wakes up again she comes through to us at about 5. I still breastfeed her first thing in the morning. She let go of the rest all by herself and is now asking for a baby and telling me the boobs will be for baby then. As for EC. I know of a mom that did this but with cloth nappies on. By a year they didnt have cloth nappies on at all but the kids responded by themselves and hold out. She had something like 4 messes with the oldest one. Due to people making comments on another forum I dont know how it is going with her son. It did make me think of trying as well with the next kid but really dont know if I have patience. McKayla didnt like a dummy. I guess I was hers as such but then again I used a sling/kango pouch and used the pram to come over here to carry all our hand luggage. We only started using the pram when she wanted to walk and then got tired. Will do the same with next kid. I did use a "jail" Playpen for my kid. (Guess that makes me one of the baddies. ) I also used a rocker with my kid.
It worked for us. I can see myself having to change some stuff when next kiddie comes along as I definately cant do certain stuff exactly the same. I definately going to express milk so Grant can do one feed and I can have one on one time with McKayla. I also dont see how this can work with kids close to age and like 2 or more kids. I felt sorry for the older one that had to cry as the mom wanted to feed the 2 year old to sleep. Discipline well there is where I lose the attachment parenting badge. I do time out. I have smacked in the past and I do counting. I am sorry but McKayla does need structure and part of that for me is discipline. Really good show but I kind of wish they can do one with some older kids to see how the kids turn out as teenagers ect. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 12:46pm
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I had Caitlyn in her cot from 3 months, (she was too long for her bassinette) i've never had any problems, which is good, because im very selfish when it comes to my bed , however , shes always known she can come into our bed in the night if she needs to
I toilet trained her as soon as i could see she knew it was her making the mess in her nappies and could link the two together, her dad and stepmum started tt their boy when he was 3 months, and when he was 2 ended up having to re teach him anyway and i breastfed til she was 13 months, because i wanted my body back to myself. All those worked fine for me, because i guess every child is different and needs different methods. Hell, if i was able to devote myself to Caitlyn 24/7 , i would, but i couldn't financially afford to...plus it was important to me that she goes to other people (eg her dad , who i dont live with ) And im sorry if im prudish or whatever , but i would find it strange to see an 8 year old breastfeeding , and no , not because its breasts etc etc, but because 1) by 8 they can pour their own drink , and 2) i wouldnt think they would want to by then ( the kids i mean ) |
Posted By: nikkitheknitter
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:27pm
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I must admit to not watching the programme but nothing mentioned here disturbs me in the least.
I would never equate extended breast feeding with incest or sexual/child abuse. And completely agreed with Rach about the sexualisation of breasts. I also don't really have a problem with having sex with kids in the room as long as they weren't cramping my style. Society has made sex dirty when really it is a very natural thing. Admittedly, trying to stay focussed while a kid is asking incessant questions is a tad impossible but if they are asleep then meh. They don't see it as wrong - those are the perceptions that we create in our kids. I am trying to raise Hannah to know that sex is a healthy part of an adult relationship not something to be ashamed of.
While I don't attachment parent as such, I also don't see the views as extreme or 'disgusting'. I am glad that there is opportunity to discuss these sorts of things so that we can de-demonise people who make these choices because more often than not, they are more informed about the decisions they make than those who stick with the mainstream.
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Posted By: nikkitheknitter
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:30pm
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Oh yeah, and I'm all for ECing. I didn't do it myself but think it's a great concept if you are willing to put in the effort. And I can't even begin to count how many times Hannah has done poos or wees on the carpet. Meh. It cleans up!
I think the consensus is that we 'nappy train' babies and then force them to endure what is often quite a traumatic period of 'toilet training' - why not just cut out the middle ground and make it a whole lot less stressful for everyone? |
Posted By: FionaS
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:37pm
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I am not biased either way but find that as parents we are too quick to judge. My biggest thing is that parents need to do what works for their kids. Gabrielle hated being worn, would never co-sleep and even now gets soooo upset if I try to lie down with her at sleep time. She has always wanted to be left to sleep (we've never had to let her cry - she goes into her own bed happily and always has).
To say one size fits all is something I have an issue with. I remember when Elle was younger I was told she'd be happier if I followed attachment parenting but even as a small baby she did not want to know....she needed her space. Similarly, she weaned herself at 14 months i.e. she stopped asking for it and taking it if I offered it so after about 2 weeks I stopped offering. Perhaps I should've kept offering it, perhaps not. It was what felt right for us and I imagine it is different for every child/mother. I do think that in our culture we do things that are detrimental to the bond with our kids but I don't think there is just one way of fixing that. ------------- Mummy to Gabrielle and Ashley |
Posted By: Peace
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:40pm
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I have a few friends who are all for "Attachment Theory" which is (as I have been told numerous times) much different to "Attachment Parenting". I personally have no problem with it, I have a great envy for people who are able to breast feed and co sleep and don't run into many troubles and can stick to their parenting guns. I am sure they were not jamming it down anyone's throat (not that I saw) with "Everyone else is doing it wrong and we are right" type of -ism's. I am sure they were more along the lines of "This is what we wanted to do and it fits us". There are a fair number of people that will disagree but parenting is as always tailor made to fit, I don't believe there is a right way myself. I mean people who have been lucky to have BF (I was unable to), non medicate (Olivia had reflux), co sleep (damn impossible with a wriggly, refluxing, FF newborn) and don't get a case of the guilt's over quibbles in parenting like myself are actually more of a regular commodity than the average APer.
I am all for laying off them and letting people breed and raise in their own way, I mean really it's not hurting me. I think if I had a MAJOR problem with it then it would be someone who is AP or adopts AT and brings me down with lines like "Well your child wouldn't be like that if you BF", that is the negative attitude that is really going to make society crumble. Sometimes just accepting that someone is different, or it is their choice when you disagree is the bigger thing to do. An attitude that can come in handy from both sides of the fence. ------------- DD1 May 2006 DD2 March 2011 DD3 August 2012 |
Posted By: My3Sons
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:50pm
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------------- Mum to Mr 10, Mr 6 and Mr 4
 
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Posted By: My3Sons
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 1:54pm
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the other stuff doesnt bother me but I agree with this one! ------------- Mum to Mr 10, Mr 6 and Mr 4
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Posted By: MummyFreckle
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 2:03pm
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I think that at the end of the day, we all make decisions that are best for our babies / children. I would LOVE Oli to co-sleep with us, but he has never wanted too...we tried when he was little and he just wouldnt sleep! He loves his bed and the space to throw his arms around! As someone who desperatley tried to b/f and in the end resorted to f/f for the sake of Oli and everyone else mental health, I find that programs like this only help to perpetuate the stigma that b/f is the ONLY way to feed a baby, and therefore if you f/f then you are a bad mummy. I feel terrible about it, and the guilt is bad enough... I think that we probably all practice a lot of the principals of attachment parenting. We have lots of skin to skin contact, we dont really do CIO or CC, we carry O in the front pack (although he loves being in his buggy).... I disagree with some of the comments made on the program regarding parenting-aids like bouncey chairs, buggys etc....but then I also understand that these programs always find the most extreme personalitys with the most extreme views - otherwise it would be boring TV! ETA: I personally think that if a 2 yr old is "aware" of what is going on re sex, then something isnt right with that. I think that 2 yr olds should be aware that mummy and daddy love each other and have cuddles, but I cant imagine that they would understand the concept of sex. I personally wouldnt have an issue with having sex in the same room as my baby if they were asleep, and certainly when he was in our room, we never let that stop us.
------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 2:10pm
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Wow, I wished I'd watched the show now. If I was asked to classify our parenting style I would say that DH and I are attachment parents although we don't practice all of the methods mentioned in this thread (and are certainly not on the "extreme" end of the attachment parenting scale). Also I cringe whenever someone tells me I'm an attachment parent as I hate being generalised and boxed in with other people.
Jennz mentioned the main attachment parenting principals. I agree with these. 1. Preparation for Pregnancy, Birth and Parenting
I found none of the comments made by others offensive. I appreciate that everyone is entitled to their own opinion and it is interesting to hear what everyone thinks. I agree that journalist work hard to find people with very extreme points of view and many attachment parents aren't like those portrayed last night.
3 years ago I would have probably agreed wholeheartedly with many of the comments here because there was no way I was going to co-sleep, I believed that it would set up bad habits - that was before I got a baby who wouldn't sleep for more than 90 mins at a time day and night except when we napped together. A few months ago I thought the idea of leaving my toddler with nothing on her bottom half was disgusting that was until I found that she didn't have any accidents when there wasn't anything obstructing her from going on the potty when she needed to go. What I'm trying to say is be careful how you choose your words as one day you might need to eat them.
Edited because I wrote a massive novel that even I couldn't be bother reading -------------  
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Posted By: nuttymama
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 3:19pm
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I think having sex with a baby in the room is different from a toddler of two. Especially a toddler in the bed at the time. Miss A had a very large vocabulary at two and had she witnessed sex I think she most definitely would have asked questions. My worry with that is children learn by imitation and the mind boggles thinking of that. I.e Miss 3 used to try to imitate her dad kissing me when she was younger after witnessing a passionate kiss between us.
At one stage or another all of our kids have co-slept with us, Miss 3 does now (although not by our choice) and DH and I simply go into another room. I don't think most of the comments are directed at the method so to speak just the extremes some on the pro gramme were going to. And yes commonsense tells you that of course they are going to show the most extreme, as that's why people watch and that's what keeps the programme alive via debate. ------------- Abigail 06/01/2005 Jayden 21/11/2001 Micheal 03/04/1997 |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 7:24pm
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As far as the sex thing goes, im sorry , but to me sex is an intimate act between a man and a woman that the child doesnt need to be partial to.
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Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 8:59pm
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I'd never have sex with my child in my bed but it's more because I wouldn't want her to wake up grouchy at an inopportune moment. I agree with Kelly that sex is an intimate act between a man and a women but disagree that that means you can't share you're bed during the process - my cat often sits on the end of our bed no matter how many times I kick him to chase him off. Also even if we only ever have sex after our kids have fallen asleep in their own rooms there's still a chance that they'll walk in on us (I walked in on my parents once and have been trying to wipe the memory ever since -------------
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Posted By: arohanui
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:04pm
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Is this the doco that was on?? (links to youtube)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yv8itNc7cb4 - part one http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rg1dNH2lhw&feature=related - part two ------------- Mama to DS1 (5 years), DS2 (3 years) and... http://alterna-tickers.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Bel
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:08pm
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Liz, the lady that is on at the start of that doco is the same lady, and many of the shots are the same - so yeah pretty much the same one... ------------- Mum to two beautiful kids
Luke (09.11.2007) Amy (01.04.2009) |
Posted By: JadeC
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:09pm
Ugh our cats are the same, they are SO interested!!
I didn't see the show, so I can't totally comment, but I hate these types of doco's. They always find the most dramatic and extreme examples of anything, and make it out that thats the "norm" of whatever. Like child-led weaning, but publicizing 8 year olds breastfeeding all they are doing is making it even stranger for any kid past 12 months to breastfeed, because suddenly we start worrying what freakishness it could led to, rather than the benefits of it happening right now. ------------- http://pregnancy.baby-gaga.com/" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:17pm
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well , my cat wouldnt be allowed on my bed anyway , cats annoy me in bed, sticking their wet noses everywhere and purring right in your ear
Well, perhaps its just me, and I am the strange one, i wouldnt want my child in the bed while lovemaking (to use a term i hate ) is going on If other people find it ok , then good for them ,thats their perogative ,to each their own I never saw my parents get it on , (thank god) and i havent suffered any , and kids that have seen it, are probably fine as well, i just wouldnt feel comfortable having Caitlyn in the room |
Posted By: Brenna
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:24pm
Ditto ------------- My beautiful 2 girls...nearly 4 and 13 months
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Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 10 July 2008 at 9:35pm
| and do you hate the term lovemaking as well ? haha, or "lets make love " gag , i would laugh outloud if i said that |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 8:23am
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My cat is a PIA. I kicked him out of the house when I was pregnant and when Michaela was little but DH is a massive softy and thinks I'm cruel and eventually he wiled his way back in again. -------------
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 8:27am
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I agree with you, caitlynsmygirl! About the sex, the word lovemaking and the cats! -------------
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Posted By: newmum
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 9:01am
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I know that aspects of the show made me feel weirded out and Annie and I kept up a constant stream of OMG texts but after thinking on it a few days I think I'm not anymore so weided out by the show but by MY REACTION to the show!? WHY did it make me feel uncomfortable to see an almost 5 yo breast feeding? Why did it annoy me how all of the parents were so confident that what they were doing was so right? Is it because I am unsure of myself as a mum?? Anywho...I've got lots of thinking to do on it!
BTW: I NEVER thought I'd have sex with a child in the room but Lily was conceived on holiday, while Joey was sharing a room with us, LOL
------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Brenna
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 9:09am
Ditto lol ------------- My beautiful 2 girls...nearly 4 and 13 months
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Posted By: GuestGuest
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 10:20am
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I just watched the programme last night having MySkyed it and the thing that annoyed me the most was their attitudes - That what they are doing is right, and everyone else in the world is wrong.
Secondly, the American mother with just the one 5 yr old I think is completely insecure and dependent on her daughter. She is smothering her so much and sheltering her from the real world and I think in time that will push her daughter away. I think breastfeeding the 5 year old is fine so long as it is done in private and the child wants to do it. Personally, I don't think those parents were having sex in the same bed as their 2 year old. The mother said they go into another room, the father said "we do it quietly" but I think he was just saying that for the shock factor. It certainly worked on this forum
ETA: if my DH said he wanted to "make love to me" I would probably vomit!
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Posted By: Neeks
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 11:14am
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LOL cats on the bed annoy the bejeebers out of me but like MrsMojo's DH my DF is a softy and eventually they come back I have co-slept with Keziah a few times but she's a wriggler and hogs the entire bed so it never lasts long so I can't even imagine having sex with a baby in the bed... in the room yes, but never in the bed -------------
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Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 11:18am
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Well I watched the links Liz posted as I wasn't able to watch the show when it screened on NZ television.
Some aspects of the show really made me feel uncomfortable - particularly the woman who was practicing EC with the toilet training ...Personally my idea of fun IS NOT cleaning sh*t off my childs leg and praising him for pooping on the floor, and the way she would hold him over the garden or toilet and get him to pee -I felt sick to my stomach, I almost felt as if she was getting enjoyment out of it?!?!?! I am an attachment parent to some extent. I breastfeed on demand & will continue to do so until Lucas decides he no longer wants to (self weans) BUT within reason, I'm not really prepared to b/feed past the age of 4! I believe It is the most selfless and beautiful act any mother can do for their child, with many health & bonding benefits ...the thing that weirded me out a bit was that Lucas is at the stage where he is like the 5yo girl that was breastfeeding - he will walk up to me and pull my top down wherever/whenever, I never stopped to realise what it must look like to outsiders but I try to be discrete as possible when out in public. And we co-sleep, Lucas generally goes in his cot for the first half of the night, then when he wakes up for his first feed he comes into the bed with me. He tends to sleep better when lying next to me & we are both happy with this arrangement. (Helps I don't have a partner entering the equation). And lastly I also keep him close to me, he is basically in my care 24/7! The longest I have left him with someone at any time is about 30-60 minutes and that's only with my mother when I've urgently needed to pop out somewhere. Otherwise I pretty much have him attached to my hip everywhere I go (well not so much my hip- otherwise my back would really be knackered by now, but hes always with me). I don't trust leaving him with anyone but his grandmother. But this boils down to my own trust issues i have with ppl and the fact that Lucas absolutely loses the plot when he realizes I've left him. Will be interesting to see how he copes when I have to go in for my tonsillectomy soon huh! |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 11:51am
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Steph, I'm pretty much like you. Michaela has weaned at 15mo when she was more interested in the world around her than BFing and we were down to a teeny tiny feed first thing in the am so I stopped offering. We co-slept until she was 10mo and she's always welcome in my bed but chooses to sleep in hers now (most nights anyway and it depends on whether she's well or not) and until I went back to work no one else had looked after her, even now there are only a select few who look after her (me, DH and MIL most often but my mum & sis occasionally too).
I am no pushover though. I use what I see as positive discipline i.e. I praise good behaviour, offer her a chance to rectify bad behaviour (depending on what she's done, i.e. if she's spilled her lunch she gets the chance to clean it up before I go any further), I use timeout. I don't yell at her (well mostly, I try not to yell at her) and I don't use physical discipline or rough force.
A lot of people have commented to me about how confident, settled and secure Michaela is.
Lucas will be fine when you have your op. He'll be staying in his own house with his grandparents and he will miss you but no doubt he'll be spoiled rotten by his grandparents. -------------
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Posted By: emz
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 11:52am
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I haven't read the replies but my whole thing about parenting is that you are bringing up *individuals* not accessories or little mini-me's. I do think to some extent its unfair on the children to breastfeed past a certain age as they don't need it, and there are definitely better ways IMO to comfort a child than to let them suck on your boob at age 5! How about a hug? I think some of these people are way too self-righteous, I don't breastfeed and feel that I am still selfless, I have bonded perfectly with my wee boy and he is doing fine.
My other thing about attachment parenting is at the end of the day, a lot of these people lose themselves to their children. I am quite blunt in announcing to people than I will never be known as just somebody's mother, I am my own person. When Jack goes down for the night, it is my time. We only let him in our bed in the morning on a weekend otherwise he is in his own room doing his own thing. Bedtime is time for DH and I. Basically I'm not starting anything that I wouldn't want to happen in 10 years time, otherwise I feel you make a rod for your own back. Just my 2c worth. Being a parent is the best thing I've ever done, but it is definitely not the only thing I like doing. Plus being away from your kids at night or even when they're in daycare (Jack only goes in 1 afternoon a week) makes you appreciate them a lot more I reckon. I admire people that stay with their kids 24/7 but for my own sanity its important that when Dh is home we get at least 1 night a month off together. |
Posted By: BuzzyBee
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 12:16pm
Spoiled rotten I bet - I wonder how much chocolate he will manage to weasel out of them? 
I also don't agree with physical punishment, I believe in praising a child when they have been good or achieved something wonderful ...and I don't tolerate bad behaviour. While he's too young to really start enforcing the naughty chair or 'time out', if he's misbehaved or being difficult he will get put in his cot for 5-10 mins so I can have a break & he can reflect on why he's been put there! He usually learns his lesson pretty quick & when I go to pick him up he will usually give me a big hug and is no longer all 'worked up', to me thats his way of saying sorry. Each to their own though. We all adapt our own techniques when it comes to parenting right? You just have to go along with what works best for both you (Mother) & baby! |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 1:05pm
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I couldn't agree more! There is no 'right way' to parent and what works for one parent may not work for another and even within the same family you may find that what works for one child doesn't work for another.
Emz, I was adament that I would never co-sleep. Both my sisters had and their children co-slept with them until 3-4yo, I thought that to allow co-sleeping was as you have said "making a rod for your own back". That was until I got a collicky baby who wouldn't sleep for more than 90 minutes day or night unless she was being held. After a few weeks I fell asleep lying next to her and we slept for 4 hours - it was bliss. We continued to co-sleep until 10mo but like Steph does she was always put in her cot at her bedtime and one night she decided to stay in her cot and has done most nights ever since. Children who co-sleep do this. Sometime between baby years and school age they decide they want to sleep in their own beds. -------------
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Posted By: 11111
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 1:20pm
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ok so to comment on the co sleeping thing I said I would never!!! do it, but when Alan was about 4 month's old I went to work at night and got home at 11pm so whe nhe woke at 6am I would feed hom a bottle in our bed the nwe would both go back to sleep till about 10am. Then when he was sick on and off he would come to our bed at night. Never really co slept with Mikey he was too much of a wriggler, but eever cince last winter when he started to get ear infection's etc we put him in bed with us when he is not well same for Alan I like to be really close when they are not well. As for co-sleeping a new born would not do this as to me they are so little that they can't move themselves to get comfy etc. I would be so worried me or DH would roll onto them. Plus DH is a smoker.
Attachment parenting I guess I do few of them the thing's, but not really i think each to their own, but O do think on here we can express our opion's, but we certainly need to be careful wit hour choice of word's like "gross etc". Aila put it best IMO. ------------- Deborah Mum to:   
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Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 2:19pm
What makes you think a 5 year old doesn't need milk? |
Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 2:27pm
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I had never heard of attachment parenting until a little while ago but by the sounds of what has been explained on here it is pretty much what we ended up doing naturally with Spencer (except the breastfeeding as I stopped at 3 months cos of health problems). He slept either on me on the couch or in his front pack, at night he would start of in his bassinet next to the bed but then normally end up in bed with me, it was the difference between him sleeping 3 hours or 6 hours and I was definitely taking the 6 hours. He was and still is fed on demand and will still come into bed with us when necessary although he tends to prefer his own space when tired now and goes in his cot in his room. He is pretty much with me 24/7 and when not with me he is with DH. He has been in daycare for little while but that is ending soon, he isn't settling well and I don't see the point of upsetting him (and me) when it isn't entirely necessary (I don't need to work so am stopping, if I did need to work then he, and I, would just have to get over it).
We also had sex whilst Spencer was in our room, but not our bed, he was always asleep so I had no issue with it, even if he did wake up he would have no idea what we were doing and i'm sure when you have a child in the room you would be being discrete in case they did wake up. i.e under covers with lights off as opposed to re-enacting a hardcore porno with the lights on. 50 odd years ago breastfeeding till age 3-5 was the norm and the recommendation, I think people need to just get over it, its not like the kid is still going to be doing it when its 17. ------------- 
 
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Posted By: Bel
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 2:57pm
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One of the most interesting points made on the whole program was that WHO say the international average weaning a BF baby is 4 years!! That is incredible!! For the average to be that high there must be many kids older than that being breastfed! ------------- Mum to two beautiful kids
Luke (09.11.2007) Amy (01.04.2009) |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 3:08pm
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Ok, bear with me. I just have a few more things to add.
Attachment parents typically work to make caregiving arrangements that are sensitive to the child while balancing their own needs as well. It is unneccessary to "lose" yourself to your children.
...and until the 19th century co-sleeping was the norm worldwide, it still is in many countries . A recent study of toddlers in India showed that 93% co-sleep.
ROFL
For anyone who's interested here's a link to Attachment Parenting international http://www.attachmentparenting.org/principles/principles.php - http://www.attachmentparenting.org/principles/principles.php As said on the site Attachment Parenting isn't new. In many ways, it is a return to the instinctual behaviors of our ancestors. That, I think, is why some of the mums on here (myself included) have found themselves to be 'attachment parents' without actually setting out to become one. -------------
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Posted By: emz
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 3:21pm
I understand your POV but don't understand the whole thing about being 'sensitive' to the child? I'm sensitive to my child and he's a happy wee boy but I don't feel the need to do a lot of things that show was talking about. I do understand co-sleeping during illnesses etc completely, I have done the same a few times when Jack was sick but he always ends up back in his bed when he's better even if he doesn't like it much I think its cos he likes sleeping near the cat actually lol
RachandJack - I wrote that wrong. I do believe children need milk at 5yo, but I also read studies that after the age of 3, the attachment of breastfeeding becomes different for a child, as in they do it because its habit and its what they know, not because they need to be breastfed. All I meant is that (like the rest of my post says) children are being brought up to be individuals, and at that age they can drink out of cups etc so why do they necessarily need to breastfeed, same as why should a 3-4yo be drinking out of a sippy cup. It doesn't do their development etc any good. I hope you understand, I didn't mean it about breastfeeding, but more about being pro-cup etc as that's what they should be more focussed on. |
Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 3:38pm
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I didn't actually watch the show but from what I understand they showed people who were very extreme and controversial in the way they applied the attachment parenting principals and some others have said that the husband was a stirrer. Makes for good tv I guess but it was possibly a poor example of the average attachment parent. -------------
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Posted By: monster
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 4:02pm
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I think the reason it appeared extreme on the show was because Western culture has moved so far away from what is a perfectly natural way to raise a child that it just doesn't 'fit' now. If these same women were doing the same things in other countries they would not seem extreme at all. ECing makes perfect sense to me - many people in the world would find it strange that we allow our children to remain in dirty (wet or otherwise) nappies for any amount of time. -------------   
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Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 4:38pm
Why should they have to drink milk out of a cup? I assume most 4 your olds would drink plenty or water from a cup. Breastfeeding is also about the attachment not just the milk I just don't see what is so wrong about someone feeding their baby as a cuddle. |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 6:04pm
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Im gonna say something , and i know a lot of you arent going to like it, bear in mind that it is MY opinion that i am entitled to but i am not expecting people to agree with it .
Sometimes, the best and kindest thing you can do for your child , is to let them go. My daughter was drinking out of a cup at 2, i stopped bf her at 13months because i wanted my body back to myself , and she was independant and liked the idea of having her own special cup anyway. she has always slept in her own bed-HOWEVER if i had had too, i would have co slept ,so long as she knew she did have her own bed My daughter is a happy , confident , kind individual , who im proud to have as a daughter , she knows without a doubt that i will always defend her (if shes in the right) because i have shown it on occasion ,and that she can trust me, and as long as im here i will protect her as best i can ....BUT i also want her to be able to be ok without me , because i wont always be here, and i want to be secure in the knowledge that she can survive without me. . |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 6:07pm
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and , why does it seem that if people disagree with a child being bf at 5 or whatever that we are the prudish ones who need to let go of our inhibitions?
we are all entitled to our own views, if people say "bf til 5, " then good on you ! do it , its your child, feed them how you want. If i say "i wouldnt do it personally " it doesnt make me closeminded. |
Posted By: pepsi
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 6:25pm
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I just watched the youtube links and can't honestly see the benefit of having a baby running around all day with no nappies of any kind on. Poo is pretty unhygenic whether it's a pet or a baby. Surely she was taking it to the extreme with that one?
And like I've always been told, children need some sort of discipline in their lives to feel secure. Clearly the kids on the show were in need of some discipline..who lets their child call them an idiot without saying a word? |
Posted By: monster
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 7:14pm
If you were watching closely you would've seen that that's not what she was doing. ECing isn't letting a child run around all day with no nappy on - there's much more to it than that. -------------
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Posted By: pepsi
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 7:25pm
I don't think you need to watch too closely to see that her baby sh*t all over the floor. |
Posted By: monster
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 7:33pm
Apart from that bit, obviously . But I don't think that's something that only happens in her house... -------------
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Posted By: linda
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 7:53pm
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I would have like to hear more from the American Dads, to get there views and how they found it. I know one of the dads commented and from memory he didn't entirely agree with it. How active are they in Attachment parenting.
------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
Alex 6 and Harry 8 |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 8:28pm
| totally OT but linda , i just spent 2 minutes watching your tinkerbell thing ...i was transfixed on it haha |
Posted By: mummy_becks
Date Posted: 11 July 2008 at 10:09pm
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I only watched it in the ads and I was blowed away as was Nigel. We could see it was the extreme (they always show the extremes) end of attachment parenting. All I am going to say it isn't me, and as others have said it works for them, thats great good for you. ------------- I was a puree feeder, forward facing, cot sleeping, pram pushing kind of Mum... and my kids survived! |
Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 10:33am
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Am still thinking about this....I really need to find something else to do but did anyone else find it odd that the american woman with the 4 year old still carried her around everywhere? I am thinking by 4 they should be walking when out and OMG how heavy would they be and how sore would your hip and back be. -------------
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Posted By: MrsMojo
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 10:37am
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I personally wouldn't do it! I try and avoid carrying my 2yo since she's already so heavy, and once she started refusing to go in the pram I bought her a backpack so she could carry her own naps etc around. -------------
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Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 12:49pm
Umm because thats whats been going on for generations and generations, extended breastfeeding isn't new, not extended breastfeeding is. Noone is trying to make everyone do it so would be nice to have that same respect back by maybe saying "Ok its a perfectly normal thing but not for me." Nothing sick or selfish about it. |
Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 2:22pm
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I dont think its sick, or selfish,i just wouldnt do it myself .
SOOO, dont I get the same respect for having my view ?? (eta - I dont mean respect from you RachandJack , i mean , both sides respect each other for each opinion) |
Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 4:43pm
well said kelly... ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker">
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Posted By: emz
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 6:00pm
Thanks kelly - you always seem to words things well. How could I not just say 'you have to let them go'. That's all I meant. 
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Posted By: caitlynsmygirl
Date Posted: 12 July 2008 at 7:28pm
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I thought you worded your side perfectly actually , really got your opinion out well :-)
You are a good writer i thinks
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