H1N1 vaccine
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Category: Pregnant
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Topic: H1N1 vaccine
Posted By: Lucky apple
Subject: H1N1 vaccine
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 12:56pm
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There's an Early Protection Vaccine H1N1 for Identified Health Care Workers and at risk patients coming out in Feb. Pregnant women are on the list of those eligible for this....
What are people's thoughts? To get...or not to get....? |
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Posted By: High9
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 1:17pm
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My mum mentioned it to me as she thinks it'll be a good idea to get it done... Although I don't think it'll be given to babies under 6months? In which case maybe I should get it done before I give birth...
I just wonder about how safe it is, I guess... Especially if you're pregnant... Interested in other peoples thoughts!! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: sweetpea
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 1:50pm
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why do the words increased chance of miscarriage come to me on this topic. I think read something aboout this somewhere but i haven't a clue where. Prehaps its worth doing some research about. ------------- http://daisypath.com"> 
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Posted By: Caro07
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 1:53pm
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My DH is keen for me and DS to get this and I think we probably will. I have never bothered with flu vaccine before. The main factor swinging me towards doing it is remembering hearing about pregnant women in Australia who got swine flu, got very sick and had their babies very prematurely. Haven't got a link to back this up but definitely remember reading it.
Don't know anything about the miscarriage link though. I presume that would be miscarriage before 12 weeks? ------------- Caroline, SAHM to 2 boys, S (4 years old) and J (2 years old) 
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Posted By: sweetpea
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 2:04pm
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yeah i think so but i'm not sure. I have a feeling it came out of USA. I will do a wee search and see if i can find anything about it. ------------- http://daisypath.com">
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Posted By: sweetpea
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 2:10pm
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OK there seems to be alot of info out there about this but nothing that i can find in a very short search that is saying that miscarriage because caused by the vaccine directly it could just be a coincidence. it would pay to talk to your doctor about the risks involoved with having it. Prehaps having it prior to pregnancy would be better? i would check with your doctor. ------------- http://daisypath.com">
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:26pm
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Yeah - I'm not sure either! I'm an "evidence based" person in general who likes to read the research. All the stuff I've found so far is about the 2009 vaccine, not this new one being developed for 2010 (this was only a brief google earlier when I realised that I'd need to decide by Monday when they are giving it out at work!!)
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:32pm
| Actually - to extend what you were saying about Miscarraige sweetpea - I read something that said the risk was not increased over and above the normally occuring rate (I think the figures were 400 in one million miscarraiged with the vaccine compared with 397 in one million without - not statistically significant difference) |
Posted By: WestiesGirl
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:33pm
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Im not sure about during pregnancy but I got it done when Jackson was about 3 months old on my Dr's advice cos children and babies cant be vaccinated at the stage.
I read up about it and decided to get it to protect Jackson rather than myself. DH also got it done for the same reason. Sorry I cant use the Linky URL thingy cos Mozilla wont let me see it (could someone clever fix it for me?) but here is a link to the WHO website about it in pregnancy. http://www.who.int/csr/disease/swineflu/frequently_asked_questions/vaccine_preparedness/safety_approval/en/index.html ------------- Our Angel July 08  Gone but not forgotten
And to complete our family, our princess has arrived 
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Posted By: X
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:41pm
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I have a friend in Sydney who MC after having the vaccine. Here's her message to me after it happened:
"Well guess it was not meant to be. The scan today showed that the fetus has given up the ghost at week 8 (its still in there, just no heart beat and kinda shrivelled up). Coincidentally that was when I had the swineflu vaccine. As reccommended by my GP. There's no way to prove that had anything to do with it. Except websites like this http://www.foodconsumer.org/newsite/Non-food/Drug/swine_flu_alert_281120090734.html if you have friends who are trying, tell them if they want to take the jab, do it BEFORE they get preg. I dont blame my GP, as it was my own decision based on the belief that if i contracted H1N1 during preg it could be life threatening. hind sight's a wonderful thing. Now if only I could get to sleeeeeeeep... :-((((( " As she said, no proof that's what caused it, but very funny coincidence. Personally, I would steer clear, but I guess it's up to the individual. ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:54pm
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Actually...I might be starting unsubstantiated rumours - I think that the earlier offered vaccine (offered in Feb) IS the 2009 vaccine afterall...that they are offering this earlier to at risk groups as they are predicting that a bout of flu will hit before the new vaccine is ready for general circulation.
I think it looks safe - I'm still reading. Have seen first hand the absolutely horrific complications that can arise from H1N1 in a previously healthy adult....horrific being the right word... I've never had the flu jab....think that until now I've just avoided the needle!!! ha... |
Posted By: Nothing
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 3:55pm
My dad is one of those people who knows a bit of everything, and is always on the net looking up news. He says that you should NOT get it, its not proven, vaccines have never worked, and do you really want to inject yourself with mercury? That stuff stays in your body for life! He says that health workers in the UK are refusing to take the vaccine for the reason that its untested and not worth the risk- the H1N1 virus actually has the about the same infection rate as the normal flu, the only reason that you don't hear about the complications with normal flu is that its normal! lol just my two cents, its up to each individual what they do  ------------- 
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 4:20pm
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Interesting hearing peoples' opinions...makes me want to learn more! (closet geek!)
They don't all contain mercury: "Influenza A (H1N1) 2009 Monovalent Vaccine is formulated to contain 15 mcg HA per 0.5 mL dose of influenza A/California/7/2009 (H1N1)v-like virus. The single-dose formulation is preservative-free; thimerosal, a mercury derivative, is not used in the manufacturing process for this formulation. The multi-dose formulation contains thimerosal, added as a preservative; each 0.5 mL dose contains 24.5 mcg of mercury." I'm not sure what the effect of a small amount of mercury is from the vaccines that do...might be negligible? |
Posted By: Kalimirella
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 4:30pm
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I'm not really much of a vaccine fan as far as the flu goes, I mean I did one paper in BioMed at uni for disease and basicly the human immune system is a wonderful thing and rarely needs any help.
I'll have baby immunised as from what I've read most of those diseases are deadly or have nasty results and the vaccines have a 90% coverage at least. (not for the flu for polio etc) But for flu I just don't see the vaccine working much, ppl who have had the vaccine still get the flu, ppl who don't get the vaccine don't get it... or maybe they do. As for types, I'm very sure the "normal" type flu kills and has killed more ppl than the swine flu. Anyway thats my not too terribly informed opinion on things :P Hope everyone has a good weekend!!! (edited for spelling and hopefully clarity) ------------- Kiara is 3 and Teagan is 2, now we're expecting our long awaited 3rd! http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: Rachel1982
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 6:53pm
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yiiiiiikes I knew this would come up, I'll ask my mum if she can find out any info (she is a neonatal nurse at Wellington hospital and they got an email about it last week as she will be in the first wave to get it, being a health care worker)
Will post up if I find out anything useful. ------------- http://lilypie.com">  
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Posted By: lostAmber
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 6:55pm
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If it is offered to pregnant people first, why would it not be safe for those pregnant? ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Febgirl
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 7:16pm
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If I was still pregnant and there was a swine flu outbreak in NZ I would have it. The risks of something happening to the baby would outweigh any concerns I would have with the vaccination. ------------- Two little girls under 2! 
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Posted By: lostAmber
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 7:17pm
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I personally think I will go with it. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Rachel1982
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 7:32pm
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this is from the info mum sent me:
Who is eligible to receive the pandemic monovalent vaccine? The government purchased a limited quantity of pandemic vaccine, enough for 150,000 people. The Early Protection programme will be focused on those at most risk from pandemic influenza and on healthcare workers (to protect vital health services in the case of a pandemic). The following people are eligible for free immunisation during February: People under 65 years of age (including children) with certain conditions (as for seasonal influenza) Pregnant women (If they are infected by influenza, pregnant women are more likely to develop severe disease or complications compared with women who are not pregnant; the infection may also put the fetus and the newborn at risk) People who are morbidly obese All children aged from 6 months to their 5th birthday enrolled in designated general practices that have high proportions of people who are Maori, Pacific and/or from high deprivation areas. In addition the vaccine is being offered to frontline healthcare workers – staff in general practice, emergency departments, intensive care units and those who may have direct contact with at-risk patients. The government is covering the cost of the vaccine for these workers but they or their employers will need to pay any other costs associated with immunisation. NB Individuals 65 years and older are not expected to be at higher risk from pandemic H1N1 influenza as they are likely to have some pre-existing immunity, and so are not included in this eligibility list. Is immunisation free? Immunisation (including the cost of the vaccine) is free for individuals at most risk from pandemic influenza (as listed in the previous section). How do I get the Pandemic Vaccine? All District Health Boards are running specific pandemic immunisation clinics for eligible groups during February. These may be in selected general practices, in other community settings, or in a hospital clinic. To find out where your DHB has organised clinics and how you can book call 0800 IMMUNE When will I be able to get the Seasonal Influenza Vaccine? The seasonal influenza immunisation programme usually runs from March to June each year. There has been a delay in supply of seasonal influenza vaccine but we plan to have sufficient supplies to start immunising with seasonal influenza vaccine from 8th March. This year’s seasonal influenza vaccine will contain the pandemic influenza A H1N1 strain. Clinical Guidelines for pregnant women The influenza vaccine is strongly recommended for women who will be pregnant during the influenza season. The influenza vaccine is normally given in the 2nd and 3rd trimesters but may be offered to women who will be in the 1st trimester when influenza is circulating. For 2010, immunisation will be free to pregnant women wishing to have the influenza vaccine. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: lostAmber
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 7:36pm
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Thanks for posting that. I was wondering if I could wait until the second trimester- sounds like that would fit in perfectly for me. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 9:39pm
yip agree Our immune systems are not so fantastic that they can deal with any old foreign organsim Of course the severity of the sypmtoms are different depending on loads of different things, being pregnant unfortunately makes you more likely to get hit hard with a nasty you may easily fight off when not expecting. We cant have anti bodies to new strains of virus naturally , so I will be lining up for a jab ------------- http://lilypie.com] 
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lostAmber wrote:Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 11:13pm
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I dont think I will. I dont get flu shots either.
I managed to avoid swine flu last season (and I actively hunted it out, I wanted a week off work!) infact I dont seem to get more than a sniffle at the worst of the flu season. (I wont be hunting it out this season though) I guess I just dont know enough about it, and I am not in a high risk job, and I dont like the idea of it. So I wont be getting it (just my opinion though, each to their own). Also if you do get it, you dont pass the antibodies onto bubs do you? You actaully need to have caught a disease to pass on the antibodies to bubs, so other flu shots etc although they stopped you from getting sick the benefits wont be passed on. (is that right?) ------------- 
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: Rachel1982
Date Posted: 29 January 2010 at 11:50pm
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I think that's right Emmi - the overriding benefit of a mum having the vaccine is that she (hopefully) won't get sick, and therefore have a fever/dehydration etc.
I think it's more that the symptoms of that particular flu are more dangerous for a pregnant lady/her baby than normal flu, but then flus manifest themselves differently in different people anyway. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: WestiesGirl
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 1:43am
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No one has immunity to the swine flu and it is, like others have said, a different strain to the usual seasonal flu. If you normally get the seasonal flu jab and then end up with the flu its usually a different strain virus from the one you've been immunised against.
We were advised about the swine flu while I was pg at our Antenatal classes. Correct me if Im wrong, I understand it that if you get the Swine Flu while pregnant it can cross the placenta which in turn can cause fetal implications. ------------- Our Angel July 08 Gone but not forgotten
And to complete our family, our princess has arrived
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Posted By: peanut butter
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 8:31am
| I thought it was mainly that when you are pregnant you have reduced lung capacity etc and so are more at risk of complications causing more effects. |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 8:50am
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[QUOTE=Rachel1982] I think that's right Emmi - the overriding benefit of a mum having the vaccine is that she (hopefully) won't get sick, and therefore have a fever/dehydration etc.
No one has immunity to the swine flu and it is, like others have said, a different strain to the usual seasonal flu. If you normally get the seasonal flu jab and then end up with the flu its usually a different strain virus from the one you've been immunised against. Thats true a bit - you may still get a bit sicky but not with the same severity I thought it was mainly that when you are pregnant you have reduced lung capacity etc and so are more at risk of complications causing more effects. Thats true too -a bit - more that your body is already under strain and working real hard on growing a babe - but I think that it would be hard on your breathing too if you had a heaving chest infection for sure I have had lots of experience talking about this stuff, and looked after my mum, nana and baby - but since becoming a mum myself I look into this stuff even further - but I really think you have to research it - talk to your doctor or pharmacist, especially if you have any risk factors besides being pregnant or with your children before you make a call. Its a personal thing and and you just have to do what sits right in your own mind ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 9:51am
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Here are 2 really good websites if any one wants a look
http://www.influenza.org.nz/?t=889 http://www.moh.govt.nz/moh.nsf/indexmh/influenza-a-h1n1-questions#vaccine ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Kalimirella
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 10:28am
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Hmm the thing is, if you got swine flu last year, (I did but only a mild case) just b4 getting pregnant doesn't that mean you are likely to still be immune? Then again Flus in general tend to mutate quite fast :P ------------- Kiara is 3 and Teagan is 2, now we're expecting our long awaited 3rd! http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 10:39am
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My understanding is that ANY FLU is of risk to pregnant woman and their babies due to the body aleady being under stress of growing a baby. Any high temperatures etc that a mother gets while pregnant will cause huge problems so you shouldn't just focus on swine flu if that is your concern.
Immunity is a funny thing and often people don't develop immunity and it doesn't matter how they got the bug (e.g vaccine or natural). NZ's swine flu last year was considered an outbreak so people have had exposure to it so that is worth considering also. I am a school teacher and taught last year while pregnant with my second. During the time I was there we had confrimed cases of swine flu and measles. I was fine and never developed a sympton so its worth considering what youw ill be doing in the time that you are pregnant and with an under 6 month old and it maybe that you will avoid crowds of people anyway so you may choose not to have the vaccine. I personally would not get vaccinated while pregnant with a new vaccine. -------------  
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Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 30 January 2010 at 11:18am
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I wouldn't get it, I don't believe it is has been properly tested at all.
If you wouldn't get a flu jab whilst pregnant then there really is no point to getting the swine flu jab when pregnant. The risks from swine flu are no greater than any other flu, it's just had more publicity which is pretty handy for those making vaccines. ------------- 
 
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 04 February 2010 at 12:22pm
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Hi again on this subject - I just spoke to my daughters cardiac specialist about this vaccine - and she has advised that if you get the first H1N1 in feb you have to go on to get all the booster shots too, or you can wait for the flu vaccine in march and get just the one - which has every thing in it - which Im far more into - since the most of that hasbeen tested and there will be more info to suggest its safety as I am aware some are concerned about this ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: lostAmber
Date Posted: 04 February 2010 at 1:04pm
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Thanks Rj, you're a wealth of knowledge m'dear! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: troutpout
Date Posted: 04 February 2010 at 2:58pm
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I won't be getting the jab, and I work in healthcare where I'm more likely to be exposed! I've not had swine flu, but 2 yrs ago I got a flu jab, and a week later I got the most horrible bout of flu I've ever had in my life!! There's no real conclusive proof that the vaccine prevents contraction of the virus, though it may lower your risk.
The best thing to avoid getting flu is good infection control! Wash your hands heaps, and try not to let people sneeze on you. If you use things like public transport, or work in a hospital like me, carry some alcohol gel around with you x ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 10:49am
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All of those wanting to get it, I will just point this out.
It has not been tested on pregnant women AT ALL. Not a single trial has ever, or will ever be done on pregnant women. No drug trials have ever been done on pregnant women after the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thalidomide - Thalidomide tragedy After the 1976 swine flu vaccine incident, I personally would not touch it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1976_swine_flu_outbreak - swine flu 1976 Everyone I know who has had the flu jab has ended up getting sicker then they ever have from catching the flu normally. I think you will find that is the consensus everywhere. Also this is interesting: last year 70% of all flu cases were deemed to be swine flu, not normal influenza. There were 20 deaths. Seasonal influenza on average results in 450 deaths per year. Forgot to add: There was a HUGE rush to roll this vaccine out, alot of scheduled trials were skipped. ------------- 
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 10:51am
What do you think the vaccine is? It is swine flu that is delivered by bypassing your natural immune system and going directly into your blood...... -------------
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:35am
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It dosent bypass your immune system, when your body comes into contact with something - via blood or otherwise it triggers an immune response, which in turn sends out histamine or antibodies and such the like to attempt to combat a foreign organism.
We have come a long way since 1976 and thalidomide. The regulations have evolved and reporting is much tighter. You are quiet right that it hasnt been tested, or as yet no stats have been given as such, but there are so many reasons for and against just offering the scary bits isnt really fair. ps - no vaccine promises to stop a virus - and even if it mutates, vaccines should stil reduce the severity of the symptoms ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:39am
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http://www.nih.gov/news/health/sep2009/niaid-09.htm
Here is some info on the testing for 2009 H1N1 in pregnant women - but its not due to be completed til july 2010 ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:44am
Your natural immune system comprises of the ears, nose and throat. Of course if you inject something into your bloodstream your immune system will be shocked into action, however it is far less effective. This is why nasal and oral vaccinations are now being studied. I did not mean to offer the scary bits, everything I stated was fact, and if the facts scare you that is hardly my fault. -------------
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:57am
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The facts dont scare me at all Kellie, because I make informed decisions about what my family is exposed to within my control, but I think those interested in having or not having the vacines need to research both sides of the story, not just an outbreak or a stuff up that happened yonks ago.
Unfortunately as yet there is no had and fast evidence to indicate pregnant mums or unborn children will suffer from this. ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:58am
Wow, I can't believe someone would willingly test an unknown vaccine while pregnant. I wonder how much money they were offered... Interesting to see that they are still stating it is safe for pregnant women before any conclusive trial results... |
Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 12:00pm
I'm glad they don't scare you, that wasn't my intention. As you say, everyone has the right to an informed decision and I was merely putting more valid information out there. -------------
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Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 12:04pm
Most pregnant women won't eat reheated chicken because of the miniscule risk there is of getting food poisoning from it and yet will go ahead and get an injection of an untested vaccine
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 12:09pm
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From what I can gather the swine flu vaccine has been classed at C. This is what that means:
"Pregnancy Category C Animal reproduction studies have shown an adverse effect on the fetus and there are no adequate and well-controlled studies in humans, but potential benefits may warrant use of the drug in pregnant women despite potential risks." Hehe cuppatea, doesn't the mind boggle! -------------
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 12:11pm
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http://www.sciencenews.org/view/generic/id/49017/title/Science_%2B_the_Public__H1N1_vaccine_Counting_side_effects
the first vaccine is already being distributed - jurys out really - so i guess we just wait and see now ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 10:39am
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I was at my MW appointment this morning, and she "advised" I get the jab... I was just wondering what others ended up doing / thinking about this topic? I still would prefer not to get it done, but DH wants me to (his reason being your MW said you should do it.) She also suggested that he get it done, but he isnt going to.
So yeah, just wondering what people were thinking now? If any one has changed their minds? Had it done? Heard anything else about it? TIA  -------------
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: lostAmber
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 11:19am
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I will get it done.
Figure it's just like all other vaccinations, you wouldn't not get your kids done for rubella or anything like that, so why wouldn't you get this done for yourself? ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 11:26am
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Me and my girl will be getting it as soon as I get over this head cold. I havent been sick for over 5 years, so to me that says my immune system needs some help right now ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: mumtooboys
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 12:31pm
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Wouldn't touch this vaccine with a barge pole.
Making an informed decision does require looking at BOTH sides of the 'debate'....problem is that it takes ages to do. LOL I am more than 18 months into my research into ALL vaccines and there is still soooo much stuff that I don't know. The thing that bugs me is that the language used, from both sides at times, is quite emotive and scary. But when someone says that if my kid gets x disease and is going to die and/or suffer permanent brain damage....well I have to wonder why they feel the need to 'sell' me so much in regards to the vaccine, especially based on what I have learned not only about the immune system and how it works but on the actual diseases involved as well. Personally I am going with my gut here, besides the fact am pretty sure we had H1N1 last year, and my gut says NO. I'm not pregnant but even if I was I still wouldn't have it. As someone else mentioned the best way to 'protect' yourself against flu is to be vigilant about hygiene and if you or someone you know is unwell then stay at home as disease can't spread if it has no one to spread to. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: X
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:14pm
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I'm not getting it done either. I don't think there's enough evidence either way to suggest it's safe or unsafe, so personally I'm just not going there. I don't want to take any risks. I have a friend in Sydney who had a MC after getting the vaccine last year. Of course there's no way of saying the two were linked, but her baby died the same time she had the shot-funny coincidence? Could be, but she'll forever wonder.
If I do get flu obviously I'll be straight to the GP for treatment. Besides I also think we had the swine flu last year-no way of knowing because we were never tested, but DH, DS & myself had the flu around teh time of the "outbreak" so there's a good chance we have had it. I think it's just a personal choice, but for me-I'm staying away from it. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:45pm
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We won't be getting it either. I was preggie last winter when swine flu was about. I just stayed away from really crowded places for a while, and avoided sick people. WIll do the same this year and just make sure we are vigilent about handwashing etc.
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Posted By: kellie
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 4:04pm
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Apparently out of all the flu cases last year it was estimated that 70-85% were swine flu, so most people should have some antibodies.
Emmi_ If you husband is insisting that you get it and won't get it himself, just let him know that just because you are getting the jab it doesn't necessarily mean that you will become immune. So if he ends up getting swine flu, he can still pass it on to you! -------------
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 4:11pm
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I've still not decided if I'm going to get it or not...
Though, after initially starting this thread with little knowledge about the vaccine, I have developed an opinion that it is safe (and that is a mind change from my original "unsureness" about this) - My opinion has been built up by reading lots of peer reviewed journal articles & after having discussion with some health professionals who were both pro & anti it. I think my understanding of it is best summed up in this peer reviewed article published in Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology. http://www.influenza.org.nz/site_resources/Influenza/Influenza%202010/Safety_of_influenza_vaccination_during_pregnancy.pdf Basically, one line of thought is that the consequences of having H1N1 is worse than the consequences of having the vaccine - and so what needs to be evaluated is which risk you want to take - ie chance that you'll get swine flu or not... - if you do get it, you'll be treated with antivirals and antibiotics which again, is ANOTHER decision about what to put into your body (but perhaps an easier decision as it can be life threatening without the treatment)....but then again, you might not get it!! And you may like to manage the risk in other ways (like the ways Miss Cheeky said - staying away from crowds etc) AND - if you do get the vaccine, you might not know if you had have been going to get H1N1...and so, it's hard to know if the vaccine was helpful or not for a specific individual! Man...a conundrum and a half...very complex when you start thinking about it!!!! And...after all of that...I've still not made up my mind!!! ...maybe the best thing is to stop thinking????? |
Posted By: Booski
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 6:48pm
Definitely don't do that Sally!! This is only the first of many decisions you'll be best to be well read on rather than just going with the status quo 'just because'. I think its great that you've questioned it and done heaps of research - even if its doing your preggie head in 
For me personally I won't be getting that jab. I started to question vaccinations years ago while doing my degree, from my micro and genetics background I've questioned the need for a flu vaccine for people like myself who are generally fit and healthy, have no immunity complications, eat a healthy balanced diet and live in good conditions. Admittedly now I'm pregnant I qualify as having an immunity compliication, but many feel and are healthier while pregnant than when they aren't - our bodies are very complicated! - and so only you as an individual can know how you feel about that. Also re: the seasonal flu killing more every year than the swine flu - yes thats absolutely true, but those that die are usually immune compromised or the elderly. Swine flu mostly affects healthy adults, so thats why it was getting a lot of press. Oh and it was claimed swine flu was the dominant strain last year....but they stopped testing, so I really don't know how that can accurately be claimed. Especially given Influenza A has identical symptoms..... ETA: atrotcious preggy typing! ------------- 
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 7:05pm
(I was kidding! I won't stop thinking - don't worry!!)
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Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 7:14pm
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thanks everyone for the responses so far. I'm at work tonight till tomorrow afternoon, so will check out the links posted then.
I don't get the flu jab, I like to have my immune system do what its designed to do, and also like the fact that when ever I get sick (which is hardly ever) that I'm making antibodies to pass on to my babies. I guess it would be good to know what are the chances of getting sick, the chance the vaccine would be of benefit to me if I did get sick, what the options are for treatment if I did get sick and whether it would change if I caught it early or not. I so wish I did what I was told instead of making my own mind up, would make life (esp DH's!) so much easier, the more you know the more you realise you don't know! Argh! -------------
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: mumtooboys
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 11:54pm
Kinda scary that isn't it? LOL I swear for every ONE question I had before I started researching and found an 'answer' to......I had 5 or more new questions that needed answering. Someone else here, someone may be able to recall who it was that said it, said that fear is never the ONLY reason to do or not do something and I think it's spot on. DS1 was vaccinated because I was so afraid that he'd catch something and get really sick or die, irrational maybe, but it was how I felt. Now that I know a bit more about the whole area........well I am still afraid, but we don't let that fear allow us to make decisions that might not be in our kids best interest iykwim? I reckon that the 'truth' about vaccines is somewhere in the middle of the two 'extremes'. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Emmecat
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 11:48am
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Lots of us *don't* get our kids vaccinated against this or other things tho. -------------   http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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It's just my opinion. I'm a non vaxxing parent, didn't get the flu shot when I was pg and wouldn't touch it with a pole either Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 1:03pm
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I see it as Im not just protecting my child or myself against an illness, but also the yukky people who dont practice good hygiene. I cant keep her 'safe' from bugs shes a kid and I dont want to be hermit so we get vaccinated against everything possible - works for me
Vaccines work in my opinion - dont see many people wandering around with polio these days A fever or a bit of grouch is worth it ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Emmecat
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 1:22pm
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.....and that's great that you're happy with that decision, Oh and we're not hermits just cos we don't vaccinate... ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 1:32pm
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thats why I said ' it works for me'
I didnt imply you are a hermit if you dont vaccinate - but Im pregnant - I have a heart kid and have no choice but to visit places that are high risk for germs and after 8 years as a dispensary technician I feel i know enough to make a personal decision about what does 'work for me' ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: mumtooboys
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 2:01pm
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I read it as an implication that non vaxers are hermits too....but hey, we can't all interpret the written word the same way can we? LOL So though it might not have been your intention, IMO it did come across that way iykwim?
I don't think Emmecat was being judgemental or anything, just pointing out that what works for one family might not work for another but that's something each family has to work out for themselves. But then I'm not her so have no idea what she's thinking........I am just taking a stab in the dark there.
We all protect our kids in the way we feel best, but we're not all going to go about it the same way and we aren't all going to assess risks in the same way and our views about what will 'protect' them will also vary. For US, this is a non-stop learning experience, it is a decision that is periodically being evaluated not one that we make and then 'forget' about. There aren't any blanket 'right' or 'wrong' answers here.....just what is 'right' or 'wrong' for each individual family. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Mellos
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 2:15pm
| I wouldn't touch the stuff - but that goes for any vaccine. Make sure you read all the information you can and from all different parties. If you only read information published by the mainstream medicals then you are not getting the whole story. Feed yourself and your baby healthy, raw food, get rest and be happy - this is the way to health - not injections of poison! |
Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 3:28pm
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Sorry guys, I was trying to avoid the "to vax/to not vax' debate...
Thank you to everyone for their opinions. I have a bit of reading to do but am still leaning towards the "no thanks" option. -------------
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: Emmecat
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 4:27pm
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Mumtooboys- yep you read me right lol It's an emotive topic from both sides and I can't for the life of me see why folk can't just take each others differing opinions and viva la difference! Emmi- good for you for reading up on it hun. You'll know the right decision for you guys, and at least it'll be an informed one. Lots and LOTS of people just don't ask or worse, simply go with the party line cos that's what 'everyone else does', so I applaud you and anyone else who investigates for themselves ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 4:37pm
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I actually think that if it hadnt been for OB I prob would have just gone with it, and not thought twice about it... But having read a variety of threads on here it has really opened my mind and taught me to question decisions that most of the time you dont even know it is a decision! So thank you to anyone whos ever posted :)
Although answering questions with questions really does my head in -------------
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 6:34pm
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Earlier on some one mentioned good hygiene and not going out when their is flu about etc - which I totally agree with - but I dont have that choice so I choose to rely on modern medicine - Without it we would be hermits - I wouldnt judge anyones choice whether I agree with it or not - I just encourage people to research stuff as opposed to doing something just cause the jones did it
I certainly wouldnt go down the natural path Mellos - not our thing at all .I dont believe I am putting poison into my kids, but then sometimes 'life threatening' can be lifesaving ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: mumtooboys
Date Posted: 10 March 2010 at 8:13pm
And I used to be one of them. I was very "entrentched" and my 'logic' was "well myself and everyone I knew had x vaccine and they are fine so it can't be that that bad." Then I had a friend point out some stuff to me and it was like "wait a minute, maybe I should look at this some more" so I did. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Birdie
Date Posted: 23 March 2010 at 9:56pm
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I am trying to decide about having the flu vaccine, I usually refuse it and actually do not like the idea of vaccinations while pregnant but was just wondering which of you ladies have had it and have things gone ok?????
Thanks for all the great points of view that have all been posted it really makes you think about things ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  
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Posted By: shellgirl
Date Posted: 24 March 2010 at 8:31pm
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Hi Birdie
I had the vaccination last Monday and have noticed no ill effects (other than a sore arm for a few days). I have started feeling my babes first movements in the weekend since then too (isn't that a fantastic feeling!) I did lots of reading up, getting advice before hand and it was the right choice for me. Good luck with making your decision. ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: babybrain
Date Posted: 23 April 2010 at 7:02pm
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I had the vaccination last week... they tell pregnant women to get it as the risks to baby and mother if you get H1N1 are extreme and so the "risks" of the vaccine are minimal compared to those if you actually get the flu. The vaccine is not a live vaccine so it cant cause the flu and therefore isnt harmful. My specialist told me to get it- they wouldnt do that unless it was the best thing to do. I had minor side effects which lasted a couple of days... but still functioned fine. Pregnant women are far more likely to get the flu and if they do its NOT good news.
Its everyones choice though... but I am happy with mine! ------------- http://lilypie.com">  
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 23 April 2010 at 10:09pm
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Posted By: Emmi_
Date Posted: 23 April 2010 at 10:42pm
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I chose not to have it after doing my own research.
My MW (who recommended I got it, and had it herself) got sick, DH (who also had the shot) got sick, and I (touch wood) have been healthy. It is everyones choice, and so long as you are happy with your own informed choice then thats all that matters -------------
+1 May 09 Angel
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Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 23 April 2010 at 10:50pm
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The vaccine is fragmented - it cant give you the flu ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: chiqa
Date Posted: 24 April 2010 at 9:14am
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I wasn't too sure about having it but I looked at all the information and decided it was definatly worth it for me. I'm a nail tech so I touch peoples hands all day long and although I'm very strict about hygene and sanitation people don't always stay at home when they're sick.
Also my pharmacist brother tells me that you apparently can't be given tamiflu when pregnant and this did factor into my decision. I felt fine afterwards other than the sore shoulder. |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 24 April 2010 at 9:42am
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That one of the things I looked at too Chiqa, its the only drug that will help.
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Posted By: amme_eilyk
Date Posted: 16 May 2010 at 5:38pm
| I am firmly pro vaccination. It has benefits not only to yourself but to the whole community, as the higher the incidence of vaccination the less likely that anyone else in the community who are unvaccinated will get sick. In saying this everything in life has risks and it is those that you need to take into account for you when making your descision. Just being alive leaves you open to risk. I will get the vaccine, but I will consult with my midwife about the best time to get this. It may be after the first 13 weeks which is the period of greatest risk of mc in pg. |
Posted By: Bobchannz
Date Posted: 16 May 2010 at 6:30pm
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I too am firmly pro vaccination.
That being said, when you are pregnant it is worth considering everything that goes in to your body. With H1N1 I read the information and thought, well, I will be pregnant during flu season, I have asthma and the consequences of H1N1 during pregnancy are much worse than any potential harms of the vaccine. I had it at 14 weeks. I also had the flu shot (I had two separate ones as I was working in a hospital at the time and that is how they were offered). Given that H1N1 vaccine is being specifically targeted at pregnant women, I think all pregnant women should actively consider it - and look at the best possible sources of information. I had the winter flu shot too. My husband did not have the winter flu shot, and is just recovering from 10 days of flu. I did not get it. A particular word of warning, or food for thought. The majority of 'anti-immunisation' websites are just not that credible - in fact, you can if you look hard enough, find information on other websites explaining why a lot of the information lacks credibility. So if you are researching, research thoroughly - and discuss it with someone who understands it. I personally trust the info that comes from the Ministry of Health on the merits of winter flu vaccination - it is not just a copy of 'drug company propaganda' but information that has been prepared to give the public the best possible chance of understanding the information - dozens of sources and people are involved. Good luck in making your decisions people - I hope that you are given credible, unbiased information and that your decisions are made not on fear but in the confidence that you had good information in the first place. ------------- www.makedomum.blogspot.co.nz |
Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 16 May 2010 at 8:11pm
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just thought id say i got it last week other than a sore arm for 3 days its fine, the chances of getting H1N1 and it killing you and/or the baby outweigh the chances of the vaccine harming you IMO
plus it gives baby immunity from the flu till 6 months when they can have their own flu vaccine, i did it for her more than for me...vaxinating is always going to be a touchy subject but iv personally seen the difference in a person who was vaccinated against a disease that got it and the same disease to the non vaccinated and its scarey and lets just say I WILL ALWAYS VAX personally... -------------    CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: Fox01
Date Posted: 16 May 2010 at 9:21pm
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Just adding my view. I have been in 2 minds as to whether I get the vacc or not. Lots saying yes and some also saying no, husband and mum were both anti it. Mum had the vacc herself and both her and my sister felt crook for a few days after.
Had a chat to my MW last week about it and she was anti it also, didnt like the thought of any vaccs while pregnant, but advised me to talk to my GP obviously but her opinion was if im healthy (which I am) not one who usually gets lots of colds and flus, (im not) and just be careful and aware of the risk then to perhaps not get it. Husband and I both feel happier not getting it at this point, as I have never had the vacc before and aren't to keen on experimenting now. Obviously just our thoughts and feelings on the subject but am happy with deciding not to at the moment. Am taking vitamins, dont have a public related job and will just be vigilant to try stay away from people I know are sick! ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">  http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: Hopes
Date Posted: 17 May 2010 at 6:56am
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I didn't get the flu jab - mostly because when they were offering them at work, I didn't have time to look into it, and last year when I'd been in the TWW and mentioned that to the nurse, he didn't give me one because he said they were reluctant to give them to pregnant ladies, and I'd better wait just in case.
Obviously, they've changed tune on that this year, because they have pregnant ladies on the posters advertising the jabs. I regret not making the time to look into it a bit now. On the jabs / no jabs thing, I reckon the most important thing is to do your research properly. Googling random websites and listening to the friends Auntie who has strong opinions doesn't count! There's all sorts of rubbish out there on any topic, and anything can sound convincing until you ask what it's based on, and whether those facts are credible. -------------   
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Posted By: jessiesmum
Date Posted: 17 May 2010 at 10:00am
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Sorry I haven't read back through all the posts.. but has anyone found any source of information that shows that it has been trialled for safety in pregnancy? Or any stats that show the morbidity and mortality rates for H1N1 compared with seasonal flu in pg women in NZ?
I was considerng having it but haven't come up with any decent info, even Occ Health at the DHB I work for couldn't.. Last year I was advised not to have a flu vax due to the possibility of me being pg. So I've been a bit cautious about the sudden turn around. In the UK they only just started a trial on small children in Oct last year and I see that they are being more cautious with littlies in Oz after the increase in febrile convulsions being reported. It's such a tough call and hard not to get swept up in the media- hype. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
DD 2007, Angel Baby 2009, DS 2010 |
Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 17 May 2010 at 2:43pm
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I posted a link to a journal article published in october 2009 in Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology. I accessed it through Occ Health at my DHB and was also given it by a paediatrician.
Sorry - you'll have to trawl through the posts to find it though...It's a pdf file |
Posted By: jessiesmum
Date Posted: 17 May 2010 at 8:44pm
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Thanks - was being a lazy so and so this morning... ------------- http://lilypie.com">
DD 2007, Angel Baby 2009, DS 2010 |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 11:08am
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I got it and was fine, and so did my little girl , we are due back for the second part of hers tomorrow
I spoke to the doc about the febrile convulsions thing - there were originally 3 different brands - the one that has cause the issues has been withdrawn I asked loads of questions - as just reading the stats can mean nothing - and bascially I was comfy with it as there were far more issues for unborn babies and/or pregnant woman last year when they hadnt been immunised as opposed to those who had - and to date this year there had been so serious side effects reported for this group - well 4 weeks ago anyway Just my 2 cents ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 11:36am
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Has anyone had the flu during pregnancy? How did it effect you? ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">   [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 11:55am
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I havent,but then I always get a flu jab, but I asked that of the doctor - last year 17 pregnant women ended up in intensive care because if the respitory issues - with no underlying conditions - so would probably have coped if they hadnt of been expecting
This is due to lowered immune system and the extra pressure on the internal organs and general wellbeing of an expectant mum, so yes symtoms are more severe If you catch it ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: Kellyfer
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 12:29pm
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C&J, I asked my MW this morning and while she's not allowed to say get it or don't get it, she said that the reason they are encouraging pregnant women to get it is because they are most at risk espescially with H1N1. So yes, the symptoms are much more severe for pregnant women and babies and they are more likely to die from it than any other group. I think the same would apply to regular flu, the symptoms are more severe, but probably not as extreme. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 12:56pm
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C&J its more the H1N1 that is that problem in preg as it takes its toll on preg woman and bubs far more even with no underlying conditions...there have even been cases where it has even killed the mother and baby...those risks for me werent worth not getting the vax when my DH works in an air-con room that cycles air from sick people in the center all the time....i used to get sick constantly through winter when working in those environments and DH brings home the odd bug that i ALWAYS get....i am yet to get sick this winter and still have to wait another week before im considered "immune"...i only got it as i am preg and its free...i dont normally get it....
also note that they have an end date that you can get it too in JUNE i think, someone will have to comfirm that though ------------- CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 1:06pm
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My MW wasn't very helpful as they don't recommend having any kind of vaccination during pregnancy - she referred me to my GP but I don't want to make an appointment just for some info. ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 1:17pm
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C&J my DH works with only 10 people in a call center and the building is air-con thats like a breeding ground for germ spreading, just takes one person to come to work incubating or having the flu and everyone gets a sniff
each to their own though, i just prefer the added protection for peace of mind while preg, couldnt live with myself if i got H1N1 and it killed charlotte ------------- CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 1:24pm
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If I do decide to get vaccinated, I'll wait till after my next scan make sure everything is ok. I'm more nervous of the vaccination than the flu. ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 1:48pm
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I think that the issue of catching it is who have the people you work with been in contact with, you still have to do the shopping etc etc and yeah to air con - hideous
If you have a family doc - cant you just phone them for a chat? I didnt say yes to getting one, it just so happened milla needed it so I spoke to the doc while I was there and ended up getting it at the same time You dont say when your next scan is, but they are currently only subsidising this for a few months, cant recall if it ends june or july Good luck with your choice ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 1:52pm
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Scan is in 4 weeks time - mid June ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 2:00pm
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yeah its June or July i heard that too, i didnt even go to my normal doc as they out of town and just went into a local and they booked me in for it an hour later with the nurse...
you have to wait 20mins after it to make sure there is no reaction but then your good... i had NO effects other than a sore arm like any shot for about 2-3days...am 100% fine now....the other thing is they say that if you catch the flu straight after or within/around the two weeks after vax then your not yet immune to it as it takes two weeks for your body to develop the antibodies to it so people that claim they got sick off it are wrong, they just picked it up before it had a chance to work as the vax is fragmented so you cant get the flu from it ------------- CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: Raspberryjam
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 2:22pm
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I had no side effects at all - I expected some sort of tiredness etc but not even that - and no bump issues at all
It even hurt less than last year - obviously thats more about the person jabbing you though And Bamn is right its not a 'live' vaccine so it cant give you the flu The GP will recommend you get it if you chat to them, but Id rather listen to someone who has done this for years than Dr Google ------------- http://lilypie.com]
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Posted By: jessiesmum
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 4:10pm
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Maybe try the Immunisation Advisory Centre 0800 IMMUNE. They might just advise about routine childhood vaccinations, I'm not sure.
My midwife was also unable to advise me as she didn't know enough about it. So it's a bit of a shocker that in the roll out of this vaccination the MOH have missed out a major group of health care providers. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
DD 2007, Angel Baby 2009, DS 2010 |
Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 4:30pm
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oh just to add though i think iv said before....
EDIT: just confirming that a baby under 6 months wont be vax and vaccine is only free until the end of June. ------------- CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: pekay
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 8:21pm
Couldn't agree more. I have never had a jab, nor will I ever, but I am suprised that neither of the 2 MW's, obstetrician or GP that are looking after me in this pregnancy have ever mentioned something about a flu vac. I'm not bothered, it just really surprises me. I can also say that my DD who will be 10months next week has never had any form of sickness or cold, so definately don't think a flu vac is essential to simply protect your baby. |
Posted By: ALittleLoopy
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 8:23pm
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its not "the flu" im worried about its H1N1 ------------- CHEM 6/12+ |
Posted By: pekay
Date Posted: 20 May 2010 at 8:27pm
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Well, she didn't catch that either
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