So I had this idea...
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Topic: So I had this idea...
Posted By: RinTinTin
Subject: So I had this idea...
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:15pm
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...of a Kindergaten where animals are also there. I'm not talking about mice in a cage or rabbits in a hutch outside. I'm talking about highly trained dogs that work and interact with the children to promote learning and development as well as teaching the children life skills such as compassion and empathy. Like the Reading Dogs they use to have. I'm sure I've heard about studies that show that animals assist in learning and development with children. I know I've heard about the study that was done showing a connection between animal cruelty at a young age which develops into violent crime later in life (so if you teach children compassion and empathy towards animals it should help to deter acts of violent crime later in life?) I dunno...is it a feasible idea or am I just dreaming? Would you send your child to a daycare/kindy that offered this? I did a quick google search and can't find anything like it. But it was only a quick search so who knows. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Replies:
Posted By: amme_eilyk
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:25pm
| I sure would |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:35pm
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No I wouldn't - I trust my dog with my children as it has been brought up with my kids and we know him... I just wouldn't feel safe with a whole bunch of doggies we don't know around the kids all the time... kids can be soooo rough with animals (when they're learning how to treat them) and they could snap back.
Is this something you are considering? I dunno if you are aware of the HUGE amount of rules, regulations and expense around starting an ECE... it's crazy stuff.... see here for an idea http://www.lead.ece.govt.nz/ManagementInformation/EstablishingAnECEService/FromADreamToReality.aspx ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: High9
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:43pm
Yes!! 
I think pets are good to have around children! Hell I had at least 3 dogs and 4 cats when growing up!!
My mum mentioned something on the news the other day about a little girl who wouldn't speak and the principal got a dog and introduced it to the girl and now she talks etc! I definitely think it teaches life skills like you mentioned! I am 19 and my mum was so worried about how I would manage with baby, my grandma said "She will be fine! Look how she is with the animals!" lol  iygwim!
I think it would also teach them a little about animals, how to approach them and treat them etc... my friend thinking dogs at knee height are big dogs and scary, she never had pets and doesn't really like them much. ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:46pm
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I would not send my kids to a kindy that had dogs.
I wont knowingly put my child in a position that could cause harm. Dogs can be unpredictable even well trained ones. I have worked in an environment where I have seen the result of a dog attacks on kids & for what ever reason it was the results were horrific. |
Posted By: High9
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:47pm
The dogs would definitely have to be well trained, but even then they could still snap. Even family pets could still snap. I went on a course last year with a woman who runs the dog handling part at the Auckland CC, she said one mistake people always make is that their pets will never hurt them or attack. It's simply not true though she said as you never know... ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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freckle wrote:Posted By: kebakat
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 12:49pm
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Yes and no.
I think that it would be good to have kids interact more with animals (I grew up on a farm with every type of pet) but I don't know that I'd be comfy with an unknown animal constantly around my child. The most well trained dog in the world is still capable of biting (I saw an article on stuff about how a police dog taken into a kindy for a visit bit a boy on his face). The most placid cat can still claw, my horse which anyone could ride could still kick if it was pissed off. Daniels daycare have the right idea. They have been across to the SPCA a few times to see the animals and they went to owlcatraz (another animal place) |
Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:00pm
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I wouldn't want unknown dogs around my children either - as dog and little kids don't have much of a clue about boundaries, dogs seem little kids as either a threat or another dog - unfortunately teeth do hurt. ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">   [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:04pm
Yip true, but at home I am here to monitor the situation, at preschool, teachers have enough work keeping an eye on the kids, let alone trying to watch dogs as well ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: Shezamumof3
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:04pm
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Nope, I wouldnt want unknown dogs around my kids at all..
Animals are so unpredictable, regardless of how trained they are. ------------- |
Posted By: NewPhoenix
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:19pm
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. ------------- |
Posted By: caliandjack
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:24pm
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At my old kindy we had budgies, pet rats and rabbitts, don't remember having fish . ------------- http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> [/url] Angel June 2012 |
Posted By: High9
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:27pm
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Maybe if it was like a subject at school or something when they are a bit older prehaps? ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Peanut
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:42pm
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Nope!
The regulations etc woul be huge. A standard DC costs about $500,000 to set up to comply with everything, I can imagine that this would be at least twice that. My sons DC has fish and a canary but they let parenst bring in new pets etc so there is often a lamb there every second day in spring and there always seems to be some childs new puppy or kitten. -------------  
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Posted By: MamaT
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 1:53pm
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I wouldn't be comfortable sending my son to a daycare like that even though I'm all for animals (I was bought up on a farm and had heaps of different pets). I would rather have them do excersions to farms, SPCA, pet stores etc. We used to do that sort of thing at kindy and it was great -------------  
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Posted By: LittleBug
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 2:03pm
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I think it's a nice idea but to be honest I wouldn't want my children around dogs unless they were being absolutely supervised, one-on-one with the kids and the animals. Which would be difficult in a kindy and I don't think it would be very profitable needing as many carers as children. I'd be too worried about possible injury, having seen a few dog bites on kids before from "well trained" dogs. ------------- Chloe (4 years) and Oliver (3 years). |
Posted By: RinTinTin
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:13pm
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Although I fully understand everyones apprehension in regards to the kids being around dogs in a daycare. My responce is, well don't let your kids outside incase they trip and break a leg, don't let them walk to school incase they get hit by a car, don't let them learn to drive incase they crash and kill themselves. Yes, dogs are animals, yes they can be unpredictable but isn't that just life? The dogs would be kept on lead 100% of the time and woud have a trained handler attached to the end of that lead at all times. I myself learnt how to walk by pulled myself up on dogs. Yes these were family dogs and no, I wouldn't allow things like that to happen in this type of situation. I just know how much of an important role animals have played and continue to play in my life. Perhaps it is a "way out" idea, but not because of the apprehension shown here. It's way out because it's not the social norm and the work that would be involved and the red tape to cut through would be massive. Still, it was only an idea. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Shezamumof3
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:21pm
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Yeah its life, but I personally wouldnt willingly put my kids in that position, and a dog bite/attack is different to falling off a bike and grazing a knee.
From this thread though it seems its a 50/50 thing on the opinions,
Edited for spelling ------------- |
Posted By: T_Rex
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:24pm
Hell no. My DD has plenty of contact with animals, but its on my terms - under my supervision with animals of my choice. She cuddled her first piglet this week 
ETA - but just cos I wouldn't do it, doesn't mean you shouldn't. Maybe instead you could train a couple of dogs and go round visiting different centres? ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: kebakat
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:44pm
| Its a bit different having one child touch a dog vs having 15, 20 or more kids wanting to touch a dog... every day. |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:49pm
Exactly ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 3:57pm
Those comparisons are a little ridiculous IMO... preventing your child from going outside, etc would greatly restrict their quality of life and therefore, the benefits outweigh the risks involved... However, having my child go to a preschool where there are animals that could potentially be a danger to her seems a rather unnecessary risk to take when there are other options... and we have our own animals at home that I can supervise her with... ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: Richie
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 4:00pm
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Yes and no. I'm all for children being bought up around animals, I definitely think it teaches them valuable life skills. I want my daughter bought up around animals as much as possbible. We currenlty have 2 guinea pigs and a boxer dog.
I think maybe just having one or two sessions a week where a trained 'therapy' type dog comes in for the children to learn how to respect them but I don't think it would be fair on the dog/s to have several children disturbing them every day. I think the dog would look forward to the sessions as much as the kids would if it was only every now and again whereas if it was a constant thing, the dog may start getting p*ssed off with all the noise and being patted etc. I do think it is a good idea tho. I'd love to send Isla to a kindy that had a few small pens out the back with calves or lambs in over the spring. THAT would be cool! Obviously the gates would have to be kiddy proof so they couldn't just go in for pats willy nilly iykwim -------------  
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Posted By: palomino
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 4:10pm
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TBH, and you know what an animal freak i am i would also be in two minds. I like the idea, but agree perhaps having dog visits and maybe having mums there at the time just to stop any hitters or pokers that may upset the animals.
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Posted By: RinTinTin
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 4:24pm
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Ok, so maybe I could work the finer details. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: LJsmum
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 4:35pm
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as an ECE teacher this would be a no go. In cages it's ok, such as rabbits, birds, mice and fish turtles e.t.c.
As they are safe and away from the children . Safe for the animal and the child. It must be awfully scary for an animal to have all those children around and all the noise. Imagine in a Public kindy 45 kids wanting to pat, poke and play with a dog e.t.c it would be stressful even if a teacher or hnadler is attached to the animal. I'm all for animals in kindy/daycare but they have a place. In a kindy i worked at we had a rabbit and every day or so we would bring him out on a lead and the children could hold him e.t.c sometimes he was off the lead or a short time. All the parents knew and gave consent when they enrolled. We aslo had turtles that would be out of the tank for a while to teach the kids about them and watch them move e.t.c Specific teaching involving animals is excellent and can happen well. But the animlas need to live in a place, a cage, tank e.t.c . They need there own space too. just my thoughts! -------------  
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Posted By: palomino
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 4:39pm
| i can bring my mini horses to the centre hehe |
Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 5:33pm
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DC = day care which is child care for children, not dog care.
I don't know many DC (& I have worked in a few) that would alienate paying customs just to have a dog or several in a child's play area. Some kids may not like dogs, maybe allergic & all sorts of reason so instead of have a DC that 90% would be happy with you are probably looking at what 10% & not every dog owner is going to be comfortable sending their precious child to a DC where they will be locked in an enclosed area with a dog. The other thing what if there is a dog attack, the dog gets put down, the DC is closed, the owner is fined & not allowed to run another, the child is traumatise & scared for life & all for what? I think if you want to run a home care based child care then that is fine as the parent will know there is a dog & will be happy for their child to be there. I think trip to or visits from...are much better for all. |
Posted By: peachy
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 5:34pm
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Check out this kindy which is located in West Auckland. very similar idea to yours.
http://www.oldmackindy.co.nz/programme.html - Here ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 5:47pm
Wow that looks great, if we lived in the area I would defiantly look at it...but did not see anything about dogs so maybe that say it all. |
Posted By: susieq
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 6:22pm
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I think there is a kindy in Whitford that has animals ------------- susie |
Posted By: pepsi
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 6:41pm
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No I wouldn't take the risk. Dogs can get pissed off with lots of little grabby hands, no matter how well trained they are. Also, some kids are allergic to animal fur.
And let's not forget this recent http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10643568 - article about the boy who was bitten by a police dog at kindy.. Sure, it was a police dog.. but it was there to educate too... Just sayin' |
Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 6:58pm
Hmm I wonder if the family would of been so forgiving if it was not a police dog? I wouldn't have been & not just because my child was attacked but also for the next child as there is always a next... |
Posted By: LouD
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 7:04pm
That was the idea i was gonna put forward. but not a daycare/kindy situation. I have taught my children to distrust all dogs (that arent ours) cos of watching my brother get badly mauled. You have to teach your children to be weary of ALL dogs cos they like us cant tell the difference between a good doggie and a bad doggie and you know kids they would just rock up to any animal and pat them, not knowing there lives could be in danger, so i would rather them learn to fear them than be complacent........sad i know but we do what we can to protect our children as much as in our control as possible |
Posted By: tictacjunkie
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 8:31pm
| Not dogs, no. We have 3 dogs that have been brought up with our kids (NEVER unsupervised) but I would still never trust them around 40 screaming 4 year olds. We've taken our (extremely tolerant) cat to kindy before. Our kindy doesn't have birds/fish etc because it's too difficult to find homes over the holidays, & quite frankly it's hard enough to afford even the basics, let alone pets, & we're set to get more cuts. Also two words regarding dogs- wees & poop! |
Posted By: Babe
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 8:54pm
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No to the dog idea sorry.
Theres a daycare in our area that has sheep and stuff but nothing that could do serious harm. -------------   
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Posted By: Richie
Date Posted: 04 June 2010 at 10:21pm
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That Farm Kindy looks awesome! Love it -------------
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Posted By: T_Rex
Date Posted: 05 June 2010 at 8:20am
There is? Where? ------------- http://lilypie.com"> http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: NewPhoenix
Date Posted: 05 June 2010 at 8:24am
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. ------------- |
Posted By: JessDub
Date Posted: 05 June 2010 at 9:42am
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Nice idea but not for me. We're a doggy family and have a lab who gets an absolute thrashing from DS.
I think that kind of environment (i.e. lots of loud kids) would be too stressful on a dog and regardless of how highly trained, or where the handler is, there is potential for a nip or worse. While DS adores our dog and has no fear, he thinks all dogs and animals are nice and as approachable. So dangerous and I'm wary that DS has to learn caution. ------------- 
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Posted By: Babe
Date Posted: 05 June 2010 at 9:52am
Down in Ohau so abit far from you chickie  -------------
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