Please Please Help!!!!
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Topic: Please Please Help!!!!
Posted By: cuppatea
Subject: Please Please Help!!!!
Date Posted: 06 October 2010 at 8:48pm
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http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/4196670/Deported-parents-terrible-choice
Please everybody write to National MP Kate Wilkinson, 130A Percival Street, Rangiora or P.O. Box 765, Rangiora with regard to this. It's disgusting. I don't care if they are overstayers those children are citizens of this country and they deserve to be treated as such, not have their parents sent packing back to the slums of India. This is totally disgraceful. I have chosen to write to other members of parliament as well, I just cannot believe that this would happen, I believe if enough people say that this just isn't acceptable that hopefully we can reverse the decision and keep these parents where they belong, which is with their children in the only country their children have ever known and the country their children are citizens of. |
Replies:
Posted By: nicandtyler
Date Posted: 06 October 2010 at 9:08pm
That breaks my heart, and I agree it's completely disgusting, I'll be writing a letter and sending it tomorrow, I hope that they see sense and allow the parents to stay here with their children and not force them back to the slums  ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
 April '11
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Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 8:13am
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it is terrible - but really they have been overstayers for 7 years! and if we allow them to stay because of their children then where do we draw the line. ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker"> 
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Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 8:54am
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I think it is a horrible position to be in & I would not be able to leave my kids nor want to take them somewhere where like would be a struggle.
But with saying that I don't understand how they could be overstayers for 7 years. They have been in the country 11yrs & their oldest is 8 so I wonder why the did not get citizenship or knew they would not be allowed it. If that was the case they would of know what would happen if they stayed without the right to & so I would question why they would have children here if they were not going to be allowed to stay as the problems would of been know to them. Have they worked here, how do they get their money? If they are in employment & paying there way then their employers may have been able to sponsor them. It does not say. NZ does a lot to take in refuges & home a lot of people we pay out a lot in benefits & healthcare etc. I get annoyed as it seams a few cases are thrown in the media to rally up support to keep people here by tugging on heart strings but do not divulge all information. Before writing a letter I would want to know the history & what they have contributed to NZ. |
Posted By: my4beauties
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 9:20am
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The reason the children are citizens is because their parents were overstayers. If they'd left the country when they were suppose too, then they would've been born in their native land.
It is an awful situation for those poor children who have no choice in the matter, it was their parents doing that's put them in this position. ------------- My babies: R (9),G (7), J (5) http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: GuestGuest
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 9:36am
100% agree! |
my4beauties wrote:Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 9:37am
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I have to agree, they parents are the ones in the wrong here if the govt let them stay then they will have to let every overstayer with kids stay pretty much. There are processes in place for people to become citizens so why did they not figure all this out BEFORE having children.
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Posted By: Lucky apple
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 9:40am
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But if we think about the children's best interests I think this is a no brainer!
...who knows why they over stayed? Maybe it was to give their kids a better life.... I say let them stay. |
Posted By: my4beauties
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 10:02am
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They were overstayers before they had children though, if they'd left the country when they were suppose to their children wouldn't have been born here. ------------- My babies: R (9),G (7), J (5) http://lilypie.com" rel="nofollow">
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Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 10:35am
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They have overstayed for 7 years... the oldest is 8 - so they weren't overstaying when that child was born but they were when the 6 year old twins were. I think if they are going to be deported and want to take the children with them, the children should be allowed to give up their NZ citizenship so they can at least get citizenship in India - as India doesn't allow dual cit and NZ doesn't let minors give up cit so at the moment if they go with their parents they have get access to funded healthcare etc in India... ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: clover
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 10:38am
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I tend to agree with the majority,it is a crap situation but the line has to be drawn somewhere. Otherwise, come to NZ, have a baby and we'll let you stay..... ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 10:55am
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I get what you are saying freckle but I wonder why they did not get or were allowed residency or citizenship. I also would like to know in the 11yrs they have been here how they have supported themselves & there family. How did they pay for the births of their children as it would not of been free for them.
ETA just wanted to add if they have had the money to stay here for 11yrs without our assistance & birth 3 children then surly they have the money not to live in the slums in India. |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:07am
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Jazzy - I'm not saying I think they should be allowed to stay... but because the kids all have NZ citizenship they should be allowed to give it up if they do go to India (at the moment under NZ law they can't until they're 18) cos they can't have citizenship in India with having NZ citizenship which will make thier life in India even more difficult... I definitely think it was irresponsible of the parents to let this happen as they must have been aware that they were at risk of this happening when they had their kids here... ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:10am
I think the law has now been changed - but because they were born here before 2006 (I think it is) they have NZ citizenship.. ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: GuestGuest
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:14am
Paul Henry should sweep in and help! 
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Posted By: T_Rex
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:25am
Not true. Babies born in NZ now have to have a citizen (or resident?) parent in order to get citizenship. So it's only kids born before then who have citizenship. ETA. Whoops, this is what happens when I leave the page open for ages before replying! Freckle beat me to it. ------------- http://lilypie.com">  http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:52am
They changed the rules in 2006 so that no baby born to parents of non citizens becomes a citizens. The problem here is that these children can't get citizenship in India, which means they won't get healthcare or an education in India. Nz won't allow them to denounce citizenship until they are 18, India doesn't allow duel citizenship. The rules have changed to stop this happening, but that doesn't help this family right now who are in this situation. Also I just think we see all those kids on the tv ads appealing for a few dollars to help them, why not help these three from ever becoming subjects of those ads, sure the parents were wrong, but that's not the kids fault. Make them pay a fine or something instead of destroying three childrens lifes. |
Posted By: clover
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 11:55am
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Yeah sorry I did know that, I was just being a little sarcastic. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: crafty1
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 12:48pm
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in my opinion it is the parent's fault and they need to step up and take responsibility for their actions instead of running to the media. They chose to overstay and they chose to have children while overstaying. Simple queries would have informed them that this dual citizenship issue existed and at the end of the day it is up to them to inform themselves.
if i was moving to another country and overstayed i'd have made sure i knew all the ins and outs before doing so, would not all of you? i agree they are trying to pull the heartstrings but unfairly, the process and system is there for a reason and it only their actions which have led them to this 'awful' situation. ------------- http://lilypie.com">  
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Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 1:07pm
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I'm trully saddened by such a lack of compassion for children.
Talking as someone who has been through the residency process and dealt with immigration i can assure you that it's not a simple process and that the information given out from one person to another differs (the exact same way it does when you speak to different people at IRD or any other gov department), and I speak English as my first language, it would be even more confusing if you didn't. Perhaps they didn't realise when they had their first child, for which they were legally in nz, that that child would be an NZ Citizen not an Indian one, perhaps she was already pregnant when they found on the problems around citizenship with their existing child and that if they returned to India their child would not get healthcare or education. It said they have been working with immigration and not hiding from them, so maybe they have just been here overstaying for so long because the government has spent that long messing them around? I don't know, but if they weren't hiding and they've over stayed for 7 years there was obviously good reason for that happening and I don't think it's as black and white as some people think. So crafty what would you do? take your children with you back to a country where they would live in substandard conditions with no access to healthcare or education, or leave them here to be raised by foster carers? I'm not sure how these parents can step up and take responsibilty when neither choice is a good one for the children. And if I was in this situation I would so go to the media, I would do anything and everything I could to try and get a better outcome for my children, which is what I believe these parents are doing. |
Posted By: Aprilfools
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 2:08pm
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The husband is reported to be a carpenter who has been doing odd jobs since his visa ran out but has also been claiming a benefit.
Anything that we hear regarding this case is likely to be one sided and there is most certainly a lot of info that we do not know about. The number of overstayers we have here is incredible. I once worked in a job where part of that job was to arrange travel for people being deported. It wasn't unheard of before the law change for people to come here and have children while on a visa so that the children could be NZ citizens and then return to their home country. It also wasn't unheard of for people to have a child before their visa ran out and then use this as their reason/argument for getting citizenship themselves. In this case I am wondering why you would have a child in another country, knowing that you would potentially have to move back to a slum with them when your visa runs out. But was this a calculated move or was it an accidental pregnancy? Would they have had children at all if they had still been living in a slum? I also question why we were ever paying them a benefit if they were overstayers? I don't know a lot about benefits but I would've thought that that was a big no no?? Perhaps it was obtained through falsified info? If these people were from a more sanitary part of the world there probably wouldn't be much doubt as to what should happen so where do you draw the line? Rules are rules but you also can't help but feel compassion for these children. For me, these children above anything need to be protected and should remain in NZ. IMO The father if he has been obtaining the benefit illegally should have to do prison time and the mother should be given a month to secure herself a job to support herself and her children. If they wish to stay here they should have to work for it. I say issue them with another visa for a few years and if they've worked hard and paid their dues grant them residency or citizenship but for goodness sake do not let those children anywhere near a slum!! We have NZers who are absolute scum and probably deserve to spend some time in a slum but we put them in a cell with a flushing toilet and running water and provide some of them with Sky TV!! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: jazzy
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 2:30pm
| Totally agree with Aprilfools |
Posted By: freckle
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 2:42pm
me too  ------------- mum to 3 lovely girls :D |
Posted By: MrsEmma
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 3:19pm
Me three! ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: crafty1
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 4:08pm
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2 boys - i would not be in this situation end of story. I have lived in various countries in my life (including India) and have always managed to inform myself of the visa situations effectively. If children were involved i would be even more sure of doing this. If i fell pregnant whilst living overseas i would certainly do this.
I agree with the others that we are probably only getting a fraction of the facts about it, but i'm afraid i must be a meany cos while i feel sorry for the family i don't see that it is our responsibility to fix a problem that is their doing. They really need to negotiate with the Indian govt to have their children considered citizens. I'm not quite sure why it is guaranteed that they will have to live in a slum on their return to India either? Not all Indian people live in slums and people do have choices. Maybe the energies should go towards fundraising to help them set themselves up over there. ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: TheKelly
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 4:22pm
ugh what a horrible situation ! those poor babies ..thats all I have to say , cos I don't know much about the ins and outs of overstaying etc etc .
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http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 4:25pm
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anything I think crafty1 would be better than the current government solution. Even if they got Indian citizenship and were to return that would be better than what is currently happening. Ideally I think they should stay here, for the sake of the children, I would be happy if like Aprilfools said there were prison time, community service, a fine, whatever, but if they really cannot be allowed to stay the government could at least allow the children to denounce their citizenship so they can get indian citizenship and at least get healthcare and an education.
I'm not sure why they would return to the slums either, but there was something in the article to do with the particular caste that they are part of. I'm not sure with NZ rules but in Britain overstayers and aslyum seekers are legally not allowed to work but are given a benefit because it's a breach of human rights to deny them a means to live by. |
Posted By: lizzle
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 6:13pm
| I think in NZ they are just deported. |
Posted By: cuppatea
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 6:33pm
Sorry I meant that they are not allowed to work and are paid a benefit until their case has been settled, at which point they are either granted residency or deported, not just that Britain pays them a benefit indefinitely. |
Posted By: _Lou_
Date Posted: 07 October 2010 at 7:47pm
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This is a really hard one. I do feel for those parents in one regard, but they did make this choice ultimately. Like someone else has said, we don't know all the details.
In my work I come into contact with a lot of overstayers and seriously New Zealand has so many. The problem with allowing them to stay is that it sets a precedent. What happens next time? And what message gets sent to a lot of other overstayers and those potentially coming to NZ soon with the intention of overstaying? As I said, I do feel for the parents, more for those kids, but they have made the choice to stay knowing this is a more than likely outcome. I agree if the kids could denounce their citizenship so they at least have access to some services in India. |