Starting solids & dropping feeds
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Topic: Starting solids & dropping feeds
Posted By: Two Blondinis
Subject: Starting solids & dropping feeds
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 1:28pm
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Hi ladies
It seems that Miss Caitlin wants to drop a feed and start solids - I think?!?! She is currently on 5 feeds a day (6-10-2-6-10) and has been "mucking around/refusing" one/two feeds a day (random feeds, no pattern at all!). She's been either (a) only taking 100-120mls (stops after half time burp and doesn't want anymore) or (b) turns her head away from the bottle at the start of the feed or (c) gets grizzley when I put the bottle to her mouth or (d) puts her hands up to knock the bottle out of her mouth or (e) gulps the whole 200mls in record time! We have been trying tasters with her (Stage 1 fruit puree) to see if this will help with her constipation prob (would like to wean her off the brown sugar water). That end seems to be working better and she loves the pears. We have gradually increased the amount to 4 teaspoons of food. Here is the confusing bit (for me anyways) we don't give her food daily, more like every 3rd day and at different times too as they are "just tasters", otherwise I would have thought the food was replacing the bottle of formula so she wouldn't be as hungry. She's doing all the "ready for food" signs (according to the Plunket vid we were sent) and our Plunket Nurse is happy for us to start her on solids due to the fact that she is a "large baby" (just over 6kg). What I need to know is... 1. Should I drop one of her feeds and replace it with food? 2. If so, which feed? 3. Should I switch to feeding her with the bottle every five hours? 4. If not, how should I space out the bottle feeds? 5. Should I up her formula to 250mls (when currently draining ALL 200ml feeds, but not unsettled afterwards) My Mum says that she had my sister and I weaned off the bottle by 6 months – I know our Mum’s are always right, but I’m not totally convinced on this one as there are formulas for 6 months+ and onwards to toddlers etc. Our Plunket Nurse is a bit - and I'm being polite here - vague!  and told me that as long as she is getting a minimum of 600mls of formula a day then not to worry and feed her when she wants This just doesn’t seem right to me as I know that “normally” Caitlin would be on 1000mls a day! And besides that, anyone who knows anything about me, knows that I NEED a routine for her, and to be honest, so does Caitlin so that she stays happy and settled
What do I do?!?!? *scratches head* ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
 
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Replies:
Posted By: my2angels
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 1:36pm
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Hmmm ok Im not really 100% sure, this is just my opinion but i certainly wont be looking to wean addison off the bottle at 6 months, I cant see how they would be getting everything they need when there are still so many foods they shouldnt be having by then but hey i could be wrong.
I dont think i would drop a feed at this stage, more offer her solids then top her up with a bottle, thats what i did with kobe but i would be expecting at least 5 feeds a day for a wee while yet or at least 4 and a half if you do some food in there. Not sure if that helps at all but this what i did with kobe and will be doing with addison aswell as it worked for us. |
Posted By: Deez
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 2:21pm
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Sorry chick cant really help with this one im still bfing.... feed her on solids and then top her up with formula i guess but i really dont know which meal maybe lunch?? -------------  
Lycan and Peyton = Moon and back!! |
Posted By: Kazzle
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 2:48pm
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you may find that Caitlin is just going through a phase.
What we did when Rhiannon wanted to do that was not drop a feed as such but only gave her a half feed at the 10 or 2 feed and a little bit of solids afterwards. I have always given the bottle first then an hour later given her some solids and its worked fine for me. I also found that when Rhiannon was ready to start dropping the 10pm feed she started to much around as well...so we just brought the times back a bit and she started going bed earlier and earlier until now she is on 4 bottles 2-3 solids and last feed is between 6.30-7pm at night ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: meow
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 2:51pm
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I don't know, but definately do NOT wean her off the bottle completely!
Babies need the goodness of milk until they are at least one, but should be having it as a drink after that too. Have you tried ringing Plunketline? If you get a bad plunket nurse, just ring back and talk to another until you get the answer you want  ------------- http://lilypie.com"> 
http://lilypie.com"> 
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Posted By: Bizzy
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 3:03pm
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do not stop bottles and start giving her more food.... 3 months is way too young... being big doesnt mean she needs to have food and maybe it is the food giving her the constipation, or maybe the type of formula she is one is offending her. she may need to have her bottles given to her at differnet times of the day, less milk feeds, but more of it if you get what i mean.
the risk of allergies and or exczema increase if you give them solids too early and from i have heard fromothers you dont want a child with allergies. her eating and drinking habits will change and keep changing, but please dont start giving her more food instead of milk cause milk is def still very important. and boo hiss your plunket nurse...  ------------- http://www.myfitnesspal.com/weight-loss-ticker"> 
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Posted By: jax
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 4:29pm
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Just thought I would add that I'm curious about this topic too, as Erin's appetite has started to increase a fair bit, to the point now where three of her five feeds are 200mls, and the other two are slowly but steadily coming up - but are around the 150mls mark at the moment. Our Plunket nurse said that we should be very careful with introducing solids - I rang her up the other day to see what her thoughts were, as Erin is about a week ahead of Caitlin and also showing a lot of "hungry signs". She suggested we just start out on a teeny tiny bit of baby rice (like Farex) and see whether she likes it or not, before we make it regular. She also mentioned that it would be as a top up to her milk feeds and not to worry about whether Erin wants to drop another feed or not until at least another month or so. I'm just going to leave her routine as it is for the time being and just see what happens - we are on basically the same timings Toni (with feeds anyway).
I can't believe it is only a tiny bit more than a week before my little girl is four months old - where does the time go !? ------------- Jacquie - Mama to Erin, 13.07.06 - Chief Cat Chaser & Marmite Sammie Eater 
Love many, trust few, harm none. ~Anon~ |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 5:05pm
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Gawd ELla is a guts lol
She drinks every 3 hours and takes 180mls - 210mls i give her the 180mls in the morning followed by about 4 teaspoons of pears with her losec and at night i give her 180mls followed by some veges. She has improved a little with her spilling since being on solids but thats generally why reflux babies are told to start early lol |
Posted By: Peace
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 6:17pm
------------- DD1 May 2006 DD2 March 2011 DD3 August 2012 |
Toni_akl wrote:Posted By: mummy_becks
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 6:43pm
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OK solids should not be given before 4 months no matter how hungry they seem. The earlier they are introduced the more likely they are to pick up allergies and all sorts. I was giving Andrew heaps of bottles at that age as he was a hungry baby - but there was no way I was risking allergies - too much hassle if you can avoid them, do so. Have to agree what my MIL did with her children is so different to what is done now. A woman I know had her baby on solids at the same time as I started Andrew and there is 3 months between them and she is one sick baby - doesn't help both parents smoke in the house around her. But she couldn't have normal formula had to have soy and all sorts of problems from there. She started her baby on solids because her mum said she was on them at an early age. So what that was 30 years ago things have changed - some not for the best but most of them for the best. I would increase her bottles, Andrew could have up to 250mls a time at that age and wait a bit for the solids. I know solids are cheaper compared to formula but wait a little bit. ------------- I was a puree feeder, forward facing, cot sleeping, pram pushing kind of Mum... and my kids survived! |
Posted By: busymum
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 7:49pm
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I would give it a try and see how she goes. Bear in mind that most babies have a growth spurt around 3 1/2mos and again at 4 1/2 mos. I have tried introducing solids at that 3 1/2 mo mark (as my babies were waking every 2 hours at night for feeding over the growth spurt ugh!) and I found that they went for them for a couple of days and then (after the growth spurt settled), back to just b/f until the 4 1/2 mo growth spurt - after which solids started and didn't stop.
I like to feed until 10mos+ before swapping drinks with water, but bear in mind that at that age your baby may only be feeding 3x a day. -------------  |
Posted By: Two Blondinis
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 8:09pm
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*scratches head even more*
I think I'm going to continue with the tasters for now (fruit ones only) as they seem to be helping her constipation. She hasn't showed any signs of food allergies or exczema (we don't have either on both sides of the family). I'll give her a go with 250mls of formula for her next feed and see what she does. I'm happy with the 4 hourly feeds routine, and so was Caitlin - until recently. I'll see what happens with the increased amount. The Plunket video pretty much described exactly what she's been doing, including the change in sleeping through the night (past 2 weeks she has been waking up at 2.30am, hasn't done that since she was on formula) Will keep you posted - Thanks for all of the advice/opinions ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Peace
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 8:24pm
My sister was told to go with the solids by her Plunket nurse and Chaise has no allergies at all and is now 6... I think it really does depend on the child, but good on you for sticking to your guns  ------------- DD1 May 2006 DD2 March 2011 DD3 August 2012 |
Posted By: Two Blondinis
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 9:00pm
Thanks Sara 
After even more discussions with Hubby (and what turned into a family debate with extended family included! (i.e. My sis and her DF at the dinner table and my parents on the phone LOL) We have decided to try for a week with 4 feeds a day on 250mls
Here's hoping she sleeps through the night! ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: meow
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 9:11pm
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Good luck! Some babies don't sleep through the night all the time - but most people will tell you they do anyway! Mine still doesn't all the time - but for different reasons now! ------------- http://lilypie.com">
http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Kelpa
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 10:24pm
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Right..just had a look in my plunket book for Paige. I had advice from the Plunket Day Stay Centre in Takapuna when I was living up in Aucks.
Paige had her first solids when she was just 4 months. And she needed it. She was a pretty good baby anyway just hungry. She does have Asthma and Eczema (mild generally) but it is in both sides of the family and she was only on veges and fruit til she was 6 months mixed with breastmilk. Apparently its very very rare to get allergies from the basic Fruit and vege groups!!! -------------  
 
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Posted By: baalamb
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 7:30am
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If the child is hungry, the child is hungry. You can't NOT feed him/her solids just because people say you shouldn't before 4 months. That's ridiculous...
Anyway Toni,  if your Caitlin was told she was a big baby at just over 6kgs, then Ashlee must be a monster!!! hahahaha
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:00am
| I agree Kirst Ella HAS to have her Pears with LOSEC and she is starving so we introduced veges. At the end of the day ur the mother. You go by your instincts and not by what people think! Its none of their business. Im sorry mummy_becks i just dont agree with the "dont give them solids until they are 4 months" rule. Ella has bad reflux and has to have it no matter what. She is actually doing well and gaining weight properly! There is only so much u can take when you give your baby the full bottle and then they scream blue bloody murder coz they are still starving. My baby has a big appetite and im not about to go and make her starve because of the 4 month rule! |
Posted By: Maya
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:12am
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IMHO, don;t even go there with solids before four months, the later the better. I had a 'big' baby, who was hungry all the time on breast milk, and the Plunket nurse told me to start solids at 16 weeks as her weight gain had slowed right down. I started the right way with a bit of farex mixed with b/milk then progressed to plain fruits and veges.
Long story short I ended up with a very sick little girl. Turns out her weight gain had slowed because her digestive system was packing up because of the dairy I was eating passing thru the breastmilk, and the solids certainly didn't help, they probably made her sicker. By 10 mth she had been in Starship twice, one time for over a week, trying to get her to grow properly, and I was having to get up and feed her hourly to try and get her to gain weight. She had dropped from the 97th weight percentile at birth to below the 3rd percentile and the skin was hanging off her. I have horrible, horrible photos of her in the bath in hospital, she looked emaciated. At one stage I had to hold her down while they put in a naso gastric tube as she oculdn't keep anything down. Then we had the next 2 years of avoiding all dairy, egg and soy. Not that I'm saying starting solids young caused the problem,but it certainly didn't help. And Maya's paediatrician has been insistent that the twins arenot to start solids till 6 mths no matter how hungry they seem. Sorry for the spiel, it's just something I feel really strongly about having watched my little girl suffer so much. Even now she is still in the mid percentile for weight despite being born in th 97th. ------------- Maya Grace (28/02/03)
 (02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
Lil miss:Chiara Louise Chloe (09/07/08)
Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:34am
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I think also they "say" that you should not start solids till 6 months if ur breast feeding and 4 months if your bottle feeding! My plunket nurse told me ill know when to do it and i have and i fully dont regret it! Im not about to let anyone try and make me feel bad for doing what i know is right for my daughter! Im sorry if i sound bitchy but u just get to the point where you have to do what you feel is right for your own child and still hear crap from others. (Emz not you ur just stating what you went through) it just gets tiring! Its like the whole breast feeding thing. "Breast is best" what happens when you cant provide that? "dont start solids till they are 4 - 6 months" what happens when you have no choice?
Noone should judge others for what they feel they have to do it just makes for enemies and arguments! |
Posted By: baalamb
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:42am
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It's definitely not b!tchy when you say you know what's right for your daughter. That's 'being a mum'. I could scream at some professionals when they tell me what's best for my baby when I know full well it's not right/not going to improve the situation etc... (like my friggen male doctor when I was having issues breastfeeding! It was making Ashlee sick and he said 'go see a lactation consultant' grr! That wouldn't have solved the problem. Completely new thread for that!!!)
Anyway, we're going to start solids when Ashlee starts waking again in the night, or finishing her bottle in minutes flat and screaming for more, no matter what her age is at that stage. |
Posted By: Two Blondinis
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:44am
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ok, so all arguments against starting solids seam to stem from possible pre-existing dairy issues (just the impression I got from the posts).
Like Kelly said, it's rare to get allergies from fruit & veg (that's all I have been giving Caitlin.) As per the warning on the formula tin "do not exceed recommended amounts unless under medical guidance". If she is downing 200mls (and also 250mls last night), water works for about 30 mins before she realises you tried to fool her - what else is there but a few teaspoons of pears?!!?? I didn't realise this issue would get so heated ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:47am
Toni babe do what you feel is right if u wanna put bubs on some pears try it for 4 days and if she has a reaction to it you will know by then! Just keep up her water coz i have noticed that Ellas poops are firmer! hehe oh and stinkier  LOL
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Posted By: lizzle
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 8:54am
| My nana tried to tell me that giving Taine some baby rice at 3 weeks would be fine. "thats what we did", yeah Nana and you used to put a shot of whiskey into the bottle to help baby sleep too. Not too sure thats a good idea. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 9:13am
| LOL at the shot of whiskey! What is it with older parents and their whiskey?! lol |
Posted By: baalamb
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 9:30am
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Yeah hubby grew up on whiskey and had solids at 6 weeks! nuh-uh!!
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Posted By: Jay_R
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 9:32am
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I agree with Emma - the later the better when starting solids. 4 months is the absolute earliest a baby's digestive system can cope with solid food. I know it is tempting to try them earlier, I really wanted to, but it's sooooo not good for them. Breastmilk or formula is all they need up until at least 4 months, but 5 or 6 is ideal. Like you have said, everyone has the right to make their own choices, but make sure they are informed ones or it could be harmful to baby's immune and digestive systems.
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 9:39am
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6 weeks is WAY early!!! haha Explains alot about him
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Posted By: Maya
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 10:03am
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Gripe water used to contain alcohol too... when I had Maya my mum was surprised that it doesn't anymore
I'm not trying to get involved in an argument about whats best for which baby here, I completely agree that Mum knows best. But I felt I needed to share our story because I was pressured into starting solids way too young by the Plunket nurse, and being a first time Mum I assumed that she knew best. And that's why I made it very clear by saying it is only my opinion. Clare is right tho that a baby's digestive system and immune system are both affected by starting solids regardless of when you start them, and the earlier this happens the higher the chance they will develop an allergy regardless of what actual foods you give them. The older they get the more resistant their immune system gets so the less chance of developing an allergy. We had only a very vague family history of lactose intolerance and eczema, no milk protein allergy at all and yet Maya was badly affected so you can't always predict these things. And when your child is as sick as Maya was it is the hardest thing in the world to watch, so if I can help anyone else avoid going thru such a horrible experience then it's worth it. I also should add tho that completely aside from starting solids, Maya also had a small amount of dairy formula as a newborn when I had mastitis which her paed believes triggered the allergy to begin with, so if your babies are coping ok with dairy formula the chance of developing a dairy allergy is remote. ------------- Maya Grace (28/02/03)
(02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
Lil miss:Chiara Louise Chloe (09/07/08)
Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 10:10am
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Yer i wondered about that coz i found alot of older women asked if we gave gripe water and were shocked when i said yes when she was younger until you mention it has no alcohol!
Yer everyone has their own experiences, Ella has a dairy Allergy but has been coping extremely well on her veges and pears. (Shes been on pears for awhile) the plunket nurse i have told me to do solids 4 days in a row coz by the 4th day u will know if they have a reaction to it. Everyone and every baby is different. I just have until hearing Emmas story never heard of anyone giving their babies solids earlier and having problems so to speak. |
Posted By: Two Blondinis
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 12:55pm
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the only "reaction" Caitlin has had is that she can poo more regularly and without any discomfort. Before we gave her any fruit puree she was so constipated that she ended up having a tear from one hole to the next and was extremely distressed each time she pee'd/poo'd/farted (that was after 3 days of not going, GP said it was ok to leave her for 7 days!).
Anyways, I appreciate that doing this "could" lead to food allergies later in life, but I feel we did the right thing for her to help her with a major problem she had right now and on the scale of things I would rather she had an allergy to pears than to have to live with constipation. **I hope no one takes this rant personally, that is not my intention at all** ------------- http://lilypie.com">
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Posted By: busymum
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 1:35pm
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Hi ladies, just in support of those who decide at solids at 3mos is best for their babies.... that's when I started eating solids (it was the common thing, in 1983) and even though there is a small dairy intolerance thing running through the family, I have got off scot-free.
I agree Plunket don't know everything (sometimes they really get me going!! ), take all advice as opinions and go with your gut feeling in the end.------------- |
Posted By: sminxs
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 2:07pm
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I'd like to ask another question about this as my boy is 4 mnths 3 weeks and i have just started to give him 2 tsp of farex at night but since then he seems to have lost interest in his bottles. He was doing 200mls x 5 pretty well every day but suddenly is only drinking 100-120 mls even if he seemed really hungry. He also plays around biting the teat or pushing it out of his mouth. His weight isnt a problem so should I worry about this decrease in appetite or just continue with what I'm doing? He loves feeding off a spoon even if its just water. ------------- Baby Marlow arrived 11/6/06 |
Posted By: my2angels
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 2:25pm
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I wouldnt worry to much. Addison takes anywhere from about 120-160mls about 5 times a day, she has never even wanted anymore than that but she is a right little chubby girl so definatly not needing anymore.
When Kobe was little and we were in hospital with his surgery at about 3.5-4months they kept trying to give us food for him, i told then heaps that he wasnt on solids and they were all surprised. I was also told that because he is on a dairy based formula if he was going to have a reaction he would have had it to that but Im still going to hold addison out as long as possible, only cos i know once i start with solids theres no going back. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 3:19pm
| I got told to give the bottle first before the solids coz ur only topping them up so to speak. Do you give the farex before or after the bottle? If Ella doesnt drink all her bottle (rarely ever happens) i dont give her the solids. |
Posted By: Peace
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 3:35pm
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I am in the same boat Jess, Olivia has times where she picks and chooses what she eats so I just split bottles, half before and half for after. Funnily enough, solids make Olivia more hungry.
You have to watch with feeding reflux bubbahs food as increase can make the reflux worse and large amounts can as well. When Olivia was having quite a bit of one meal a day I changed it to more smaller meals so her tummy could digest it a bit better, she got a little refluxy but it settled down with routine. When I first started I picked the time of the day were she always tries to down the whole bottle (which was some time after lunch). sminxs, same thing with offer bottle before and after, but the minimum is 600mls. What about giving solids earlier in the day? This will also cancel out any concerns you could have over allergic reactions. Olivia has reflux so introducing food initially I kept it so that she had plenty of time left in the day to see how her belly reacts. Also have you checked in his wee mouth? Red cheeks? Olivia chews up the nipples of her bottle outrageously when she is teething (she has 2 teeth). You could even go the flip side of the coin and stop offering solids (or as much solids) for a few days to see how he goes. If you are genuinely concerned and the Plunket nurses "hes fine" is not satisfying you then I would suggest taking him to a GP. ------------- DD1 May 2006 DD2 March 2011 DD3 August 2012 |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 4:22pm
Ellas been fine with hers if anything shes improved slightly with being on that amount. Shes never spilled or brought up any solids. She still spills her milk exactly the same as before so im not concerned. I to give it to her when shes most hungry which tends to be in the morning and at night 
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Posted By: Maya
Date Posted: 02 November 2006 at 4:25pm
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Bottle/breast definitely first till after 9 months. They need the milk more than the solids until then.
Not trying to be an expert or anything, but the only benefit of having a sick baby was having a dietician on hand to guide me thru the whole solids thing when Maya was smaller. ------------- Maya Grace (28/02/03)
(02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
Lil miss:Chiara Louise Chloe (09/07/08)
Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Posted By: Rachael21
Date Posted: 04 November 2006 at 12:55pm
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Jack was having at least 8 feeds a day until he started solids I was so tired but I waited til 4 motnhs because of a family history of allergies. Jack had mild reflux so I was told to start at 4 months for that. It's hard with all the conflicting advice but I would personally wait til 4 months and maybe try giving more bottles. Keep with the little bits for her constipation but maybe not every day til 4 months. After all its only a couple of weeks and she might be having a growth spurt that might settle down. The later they start the better (for you its suc a hassle cooking up batches of food lol)
We started Jack at lunch time and fed him his milk and then wee bits of solids. He had 2 feeds that first day cos he gobbled 2 spoons down. It was laso the day he stopped having night feeds. |