| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
dimple 
Newbie
Joined: 16 May 2010
Points: 3
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(0)
 Quote  Reply
 Topic: child support/parents rights
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 10:34am |
|
I have a family member who has a child with a girl that he no longer is with.
Throughout the pregnancy he told her he didn't want the baby to begin with but she decided to keep it.
Now this family member has been a good father since his son was born as much as he could be. He works odd hours and they used to stay at his house on his RDO's etc.
He hasn't paid child support as she is on the DPB but he has saved money for when he is meant to pay child support but she hasn't "claimed" that money so to speak.
Now the mother wants to go all official with payments etc
She said a number based on what she thought he earnt when he earns less then this, and he said no and came back with a counter offer. I know for a fact that the mother has a friend who is a family lawyer so is feeding her information and what to say to him.
He used to spend anywhere between 2-4days with his son and it has slowly dwindled down. She stopped staying at his house ( I suggested this because she was having trouble breaking away from the relationship and they kept having sex) Now he is only allowed to see his son one day a week which with his roster may not be pheasable (sp) as he works a rotating roster and that he isn't allowed to even pick him up.
She has just called him and said that he isnt even allowed him on this particular day.
It's horrible as their son is now not going to grow up with his father even though he loves him and is willing to support him. Their son won't know his fathers family as she may not let us even see him as the father may be round.
I didn't think that the mother was this vindictive she seemed lovely.
Now I know the father isn't perfect and that he has done some dumb stuff, but everytime she has needed him he has been there for him, paid for doctors visits taken her to all her appointments as she has no car, he may not have paid for alot of stuff but he has bought some of it. He helped her find her flat etc.
I think the most important thing is that he loves his son and wants to be a part of his life. He isn't one of those fathers who doesn't want to be there, and wants to watch him grow and now she is stopping him from doing that.
So anyway what can my family member do? Their child is 8 almost 9 months old on solids, but still bf. She won't let him have him over night because she's not ready for that (fair enough) but also because he has relied on feeding to sleep for such a long time, therefore evertime he has woken at night he has expected to be fed.
He has spoken to a lawyer already I think but he didn't want to go down the court route if he could avoid it.
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
mylilmosaic
Senior Member
Joined: 14 June 2007
Location: New Zealand
Points: 1348
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 11:09am |
Hi Dimple
If he wants to pay child support he should do it through IRD, they will assess what he can afford to pay based on his income and expenses. If she is getting the DPB, and then if she had a private arrangement with your family member then she is supposed to declare that amount to Winz and then her benefit would be adjusted accordingly. So what I am trying to say is that you can't collect the dpb and then have child support on top of that as well. Arrghh hope that makes some sense. 
Although he doesn't want to go through the courts, I think if their relationship has broken down to the point where they are never going to agree on set visitation, and especially if she keeps changing it then I really think he has no option but to get on to his lawyer and start proceedings to get a parenting order in place. At least with a parenting order in place she would have to stick to what it says, and also Im pretty sure as the child gets older the parenting order can be amended to allow overnight visits.
I hope he gets it sorted and is able to build that relationship with his son, he sounds like he is a lovely dad
eta: edited for spelling
Edited by Appy2
|
|
|
|
kiwi2
Senior Member
Joined: 29 July 2008
Points: 658
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 11:22am |
|
Hey dimple
I second everything that appy said above. She sounds like she is trying to do a private arrangement for child support to top up the dpb and avoid the rules. If she wants to go all legal then I suspect the dad should too. I would go to a family lawyer and get visitation rights or shared custody sorted. He has rights. Just because generations before him didn't always persue this he has the law to back him and if he really wants a relationship with the child then the law will help him. First he needs to sort out with IRD the child support payments. I am sure a family lawyer can point him in the right direction. He is the dad and it is his responsibility to support the child financially.
Finally he should be able to apply for legal aid to do all of this if he can't afford it. I know 13 years ago I did in regards to custody and visitation.
|
|
jazzy
Senior Member
Joined: 16 January 2009
Points: 8858
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 1:13pm |
|
If she is on a benefit she is not entitled to child support as that goes to WINS from IRD....WINS will sort that out if he is named as the father they will follow that up as she will get extra on her benefit, a friend was told she would get an extra $20 but not sure what it would be now if any.
If she is working & not getting a benefit they can come to a join agreement & he can pay her direct, best to write up an agreement & both sign it.
If they can not come to an agreement then she can go through IRD, they will assess his income & is work will deduct it & sent it to IRD & she will receive it that way.
Be prepared for a large amount & any increases or o/t he gets will also be added to his yr's income.
He can go for join custody, then I think neither have to pay child support as the care is shared.
At the end of the day it is the child's best interests that need to be put first.
If I was him I would get a lawyer so everything is in writing after all if he has to pay out for a child then he should be able to have a say in his upbringing an care & be able to share in it also.
|
|
mylilmosaic
Senior Member
Joined: 14 June 2007
Location: New Zealand
Points: 1348
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 1:19pm |
 dimple wrote:
He hasn't paid child support as she is on the DPB but he has saved money for when he is meant to pay child support but she hasn't "claimed" that money so to speak.
|
Just to add to what I said above, the only reason he does not have to pay child support is if he is not on the birth certificate, or she has not named him to Winz as the father.
If he is put down as the father then the mother being on the dpb though does not mean he does not have to pay, it just means that it goes to the government (because she is getting the dpb) rather than to her and also she cannot claim any child support put aside for the child unless she was off the dpb. If say when the child is older and she was working then any child support collected would get paid directly to her by the IRD.
Gosh I hope thats not too confusing.
|
|
|
|
mylilmosaic
Senior Member
Joined: 14 June 2007
Location: New Zealand
Points: 1348
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 1:21pm |
ahhh snap, Jazzy said it better lol 
|
|
|
|
jazzy
Senior Member
Joined: 16 January 2009
Points: 8858
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 16 May 2010 at 1:25pm |
|
|
|
dimple
Newbie
Joined: 16 May 2010
Points: 3
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 11:06am |
|
She is on the DPB and she knows that if she names him as the father she gets $30 extra a week, so atm she is being penalised $30.
What they are wanting to do is he gives her $30 a week and the rest goes into a trust for his son. So she won't be able to touch it. I don't know if this is legally allowed or not?
I know the father has been saving money so that if she does happen to name him then he has the money to back pay. Because she could be that vindictive so it seems.
He did end up seeing his son yesterday, which is great, his grandmother got to spend time with him. Turns out the mother told the fathers mum that he wouldn't pay child support and she told him he wasn't allowed to see his son until she did. When grandma got home she got told his version.
I agree the most important person in the mix is the child. Even I have told her not to punish the dad because there are many out there who want nothing to do with their children and he does.
|
|
jazzy
Senior Member
Joined: 16 January 2009
Points: 8858
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 11:22am |
|
dimple I think he should be careful if giving her money because if he ends up having to pay child support they will not take that in to account. Depending on what income he is on he could end up paying a lot more than $30, more like $100 plus a week, & I would put the saved money into an account & not a trust fund in case he has to pay the outstanding CS. I know someone who had to pay about 6 yrs worth & ended up owing IRD over 30k.
Also if he does end up paying CS which is for 18 -19yrs then he should be on the birth cert.
I also don't get why she is trying to extort (sp) money from him & it sounds like the legal advise she is getting is incorrect because she is breaking the law in several ways.
I would take her to a family court. If he want's contact with his son & is willing to pay CS then he should have rights to the child.
|
|
kiwi2
Senior Member
Joined: 29 July 2008
Points: 658
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 11:30am |
|
I think your family member is being played a bit. What happens if she goes off the dpb and then names him the father and he has to back pay her the child support. Shouldn't that go to winz to cover the dpb she was receiving. I think the reason ex partners pay the money to winz is to suport the country to support the child. I don't want this to be taken as a anti dpb posting as I was on the dpb but I also followed the rules and named the father. I don't like people trying to play the system.
|
|
freckle
Senior Member
Joined: 03 December 2008
Points: 4773
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 12:02pm |
|
I agree with kiwi2 and I too was on the DPB many years ago... I would definitely be encouraging him getting his name on the birth cert and formalising both CS and visitation rights. And as Jazzy said CS can be much much for than $30... my ex pays around $120PW.
|
|
mum to 3 lovely girls :D
|
|
jaz
Senior Member
Joined: 01 January 1900
Points: 877
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 7:12pm |
|
The Dad didn't want the baby to start with, has let visits dwindle down from 3-4 days a week to maybe once a week, and hasn't paid a cent child support in the whole 9 months yet wants to be a part of his life. Hmmm ... sounds to me like he doesn't actually want the responsibility at all or for a baby to inconvenience his life. Perhaps he needs to step up and be a man and take on some responsibility for the situation.
If he has a rotating roster he can go to her with a suggested visitation cycle which can be set say three months in advance. He can ask her to put his name on the birth certificate and start paying child support either to her or to WINZ. And he can reimburse her the $30 per week she has lost by not naming him so he doesn't have to pay child support. Once he's stepped up and started actiing like a responsible adult rather than a donor, I am sure she will be accommodating regarding visitations and making sure they work in around his roster.
As for the family, are they actually bothering to go and see the child? Or sitting back complaining that she won't visit them which might be more to do with not having a car or much money?
Why is she expected to divert all child support into a separate fund for the child later? Isn't it as much the Dad's responsibility to feed, clothe and provide for the child. She is only asking he reimburse her the $30 she is losing, and he is expecting to give her nothing towards the day to day costs of raising a child????
Sorry to vent, there are so many really good Dad's out there who don't have as much contact with their children as they deserve or have to fight hard to get it, because irresponsible Dads have stuffed it up for them. It really annoys me to hear stories like this where the Dad expects to contribute nothing and only visit when it suits.
|
|
|
|
dimple
Newbie
Joined: 16 May 2010
Points: 3
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 17 May 2010 at 11:39pm |
|
No he didn't want the baby to begin with as he wasn't ready for the responsibility and they had only been together for three months before she became pregnant in saying that all through her pregnancy she lived at his house and he took her to all appointments including specialist appointments.
He has bought things for his son including neccessities nappies, cot, clothes etc. He hasn't LET the visits drop down to once a week she has STOPPED him being allowed to see his son,everytime they have faught she has taken a little bit away from him. What is he meant to do take him without her agreeing that would open up awhole lot of other issues. He hasn't paid child support as she said she was doing him a "favour" as he would have to pay $xx amount for childsupport.
He has the money there waiting with the childsupport incase she wants to be manipulative and all off a sudden say he has to pay back childsupport. I can see his point in he doesn't want put the money into a separate account and relinquish that as soon as he does it is no longer his money and if she decides 10years down the track that what ever arrangement isn't suitable then he would be forced to back pay regardless of what he has already paid. And from what I can see it could happen that way. Ideally they would reach some sort of private agreement that suits the both of them.
We as the family do make an effort to see their child. We have organised for her to go to his families house when he has been away even though there wasn't a close friendship as we wanted to see his son even if he wasn't home. I take my own child over there once a week and the two play. I have looked after their son when she has needed to do something. When she has gone to the movies we have looked after him not her family.
As she is on the DPB she wouldn't get the full amount of the child support that he pays that would go to the government and she would only get an extra $30 a week which as I have stated he is willing to give her. The rest of the money would go into an account for their son should there be a great need for him to have something, or even better yet for his future education etc. He isn't against providing for his son at all, if she called and said I need money for nappies he would say sweet here's $50 the point is she doesn't she uses their son to get at him.
This is a second account as my original account identifies me too much and I am concerned it may be noticed and she will use this against him. But I can assure you that anyone that has talked to me at length would assure you that I love this boy as much as I could.
Jaz I understand where you are coming from, but the fact is he has tried. She uses bfing against him being able to look after him (no I'm not against bfing as I am bfing my child). There has only been one time when he has said no to looking after him and the reason not being work. We look forward to the days when we see their son. Even to the point when family gatherings have been taking place and we insisted they come. As for the visiting when it suits he works a rotating shift with nights and days as a security officer does so he needs flexibility in visitation so yes that is when it suits him. But the point is he WANTS to see him, he wants to spend time with him.
My posts might sound abit cryptic but as I said I dont want this used against him.
|
|
jaz
Senior Member
Joined: 01 January 1900
Points: 877
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 18 May 2010 at 7:26am |
|
Firstly you can't apply to have child support back dated. When you apply for it, it will be assessed and granted from that date. If he has set money aside he could continue to pay money into it and set it up as a joint account with her so she has access to money when she needs it. If she applies for child support through IRD then he just stops paying into this account and makes payments through IRD.
Secondly, if he has a rotating roster surely he knows when his rostered days off should fall some weeks in advance. Can't he go to her with his roster for the month and make a plan so she knows what days he can visit? Or could he go to his manager and ask for a standard day off so he can visit on a regular basis. I am an HR Manager and have accommodated these requests all the time.
If he wants a formalised visitation agreement, called a parenting agreement, it will work out much better for him if he is making the effort to get a routine around visitations and contributing towards the costs of raising his child.
I suspect that given the age of the child, and that he/she is still being BF formal visitations would be short and frequent that fit in around feeds and sleeps so the baby can stay in its normal routine. His lawyer will be able to advise him here.
|
|
|
|
jazzy
Senior Member
Joined: 16 January 2009
Points: 8858
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 18 May 2010 at 7:44am |
|
I really feel sorry for some guys in this situation. Lets face it some women just want babies &don't care where the sperm comes from, some do it to trap a man.
Guys have no say once she is pregnant if they don't want it it is just tough sh*t...if she wants to keep it she will & he will have a financial responsibility for the next 19 yrs.
Guys think with there pants & don't take into account what will happen if the girl gets pregnant.
I agree that the guy should take responsibility for the child & help support but there should be equal rights & since he is forced to pay then he should have a say in how that child is raised, but that is not always the case.
The only way out of paying CS is shared custody...but a lot of omen would not go foe that as they will not be able to sit on a benefit.
If you are in a relationship & decided to have kids together & he leaves than yes he should pay CS, but not all cases are black & white.
|
|
child support/parents rights
