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Berg19 
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 Topic: Gastric Reflux in Newborns
Posted: 18 November 2009 at 8:43am |
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My baby is two weeks old tomorrow. I know something isn't right but whenever i would ask MW etc she would say "thats normal" when i knew deep down its not!
Jarvi feeds constantly - i mean probily about 20 hours a day (not normal in my books). When i take him off he starts screaming and hunches up in a ball and pants and pushes his legs down on me really hard. He always gets the hiccups, won't sleep in his cot - let alone really sleep at all! but when he does it will only be upright on somebody's chest.He didn't spill milk up before, but last night he split milk up all over me and through my bed! Has anyones baby got/have gastric reflux?? Doe's it sound like it??
I've read fennel helps? Was going to buy some capsules and give it a go.
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mollycat
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 8:54am |
It does sound suspiciously like reflux. My baby has silent reflux and from 3- 6.5 weeks, he pretty much never slept because as soon as you put him on his back he started screaming.
Reflux babies often either lose weight because they are in pain and don't want to eat or put on huge quantities because they always want to eat/drink to help soothe the pain.
If you are BF - dairy is often a big culprit with reflux babies in terms of the amount of spilling. However, I would probably head to the doc and see if they can't give you some Gaviscon to trial - if he seems better then you will most likefly have your answer.
And it kind of sounds like he might have relatively severe reflux so I'm not sure the fennel will help. Trust me - I gave that a try too  To be honest, I tried everything and the only thing that has helped is Gaviscon and time. Now that he's almost 3 months he has greatly improved. But that thought doesn't help you when they are screaming and in pain for alot of the day...
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myfullhouse
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 9:03am |
Neither of my boys had reflux but a friend's baby did and she found that a dummy helped alot as she could suck on that to help relieve that pain. I have also heard that hammocks work well for getting babies with eflux to sleep, maybe you could hire one to see if it helps. You can also get them on Trade Me (that's where I got mine).
Good luck and 
Oh and if your gut tells you there is something wrong then keep persuing it until someone gets you the help you need
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SarahJane
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 9:09am |
Go and see your gp, and write a list of symptoms.
http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz/Symptoms.htm
http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz/MedicalTreatment/ManagingUncomplicatedReflux.htm
Do you eat a lot of dairy? Dairy in the bfing mum causes around a third of reflux, worth reducing or cutting out to see if it helps. This incudes complan and other drinks often recommended.
Fennel ain't going to cut it. Gaviscon is a thickener, it helps the milk stay in the tummy. This will be a first thingo try.
Management techniques: keep bubs upright for 30 min after feed. Sleep in buggy or bouncinette or by baby-wearing. Settle with left hand side down to help milk drain into the oesophagus (or on tummy). Movement helps sleep.
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SarahJane
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 9:12am |
Oh and the constant snacking is very symptomatic. It is just the same as you wanting to drink milk when you have heartburn. The trouble is that bubs can overfeed leading to spilling, and the snackig makes it impossible to settle into a routine in the next couple of months.
Really try hard to get all the wind up, any air down there will make it a hundred times worse.
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Hope
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 1:21pm |
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Seriously get to the doctor ASAP. I wish I didn't listen to midwife who said everything was normal and "that's what babies do" when my son was displaying all the symptoms you described. It took quite a while to get him onto appropriate medication because they make you try the softer options - gaviscon, feed thickener - before they will let you try stronger medications - ranitidine, losec. My life is completely different now that my son is on the appropriate meds.
Also, what made a huge difference when my son was that age was strictly feeding him every three hours and making sure the breast was drained (so the baby doesn't get foremilk only which can upset their tummies). If baby is really hungry you can offer both breasts. I cluster fed with shorter feeds hourly in the evenings and after that hopefully my baby would sleep for a slightly longer stretch. When I was demand feeding it made the reflux so much worse because he was over-full and throwing up even more.
Don't be a pushover at the doctor like I was a few times. You're the mum, you're there with the baby 24/7 and you know something's wrong.
Good luck!
P.S If you baby does turn out to have reflux don't listen to other mums talking about how well their baby sleeps etc. Reflux babies are in a category of their own and often don't sleep and settle like non-reflux babies.
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emz
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 1:36pm |
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I feel your pain, that sounds EXACTLY like what my girl started off life like. She was very spilly though, didn't gain weight for the first month because we couldn't get enough milk in, and the stuff she did get in, all came back up.
At 2 weeks she had gaviscon, which worked for a couple of weeks (it usually works for all babies for a couple of weeks, then the ones with more severe reflux will start getting worse again) and now she's on zantac twice a day which has helped immensely. If she has an attack we mix up some gaviscon and syringe it in.
Also, talk to your doctor about giving baby pamol if needed - our girl was in so much pain the doc put her on constant pamol for a few days while the zantac starting helping.
At 3 months, she's still pretty bad, vomits constantly (but not huge amounts), but isn't in as much pain which is great. We've side-slept her since about a week I think which definitely helped, and I've had to hold her a lot. (she lived on me for the first few weeks which is pretty hard with a toddler too).
Make sure, if he does become quite spilly, to always have a change of clothes for both of you, many spill cloths around, and burp 2-3 times during feeding.
But definitely go to your doctor, I wish we'd known how severe hers was and moved onto the zantac a lot quicker than we did so we could enjoy our wee girl and not see her in pain all day.
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Berg19
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 2:23pm |
thanks everyone!
Went to the doctor this morning and he just kept saying to me, it must be because you don't have enough milk and put him on formula. I kept saying i know he is getting plenty because he has really wet nappies every 2 hours and im his mum, i know when hes actually hungry! Finally he decided to ring the hospital and then prescribed him gaviscon and omeprazole. Have given him one sachet of gaviscon, and hes had a 1 hour sleep and is now asleep again after a feed etc.
It definitely is hard for me seeing him in pain and not being able to do anything about it  i want him to be a happy baby and enjoy life! When hes probily thinking wat the hell have i come into! But everyone says gaviscon is really bad, and i don't want to keep him on it forever. Is it meant to just fix itself or what? I've ordered some of that Rhugar stuff?
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Berg19
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 2:24pm |
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Also looking at a safe-t-sleep reflux so i can side sleep him to make it a bit more comfortable? Has anyone else used this? Worked/not worked??
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Hope
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 2:25pm |
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Oh yeah, I forgot to add in my earlier post, another reason you need to get to your doc ASAP is because if your baby needs stronger reflux meds like ranitidine or losec, these will most likely need to be prescribed by a paediatrician. Your GP needs to refer you to a paed and it can take a while to see one. Our bub has needed to see the paed twice about his reflux and we had to wait a few weeks both times because there was a long waiting list for the paeds in our area.
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kiwisj
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 3:31pm |
Hey hun that's great that you got out to your doctor and stood firm when you felt like you were being fobbed off Now you have got the ball rolling, hopefully the things people have suggested here will help and if Jarvi gets worse again you have been to the doc already and that will (well, should) make it easier if you need to get stronger meds - they like you to try the "softer" stuff first.
Things that helped Callum's reflux - sleeping in his capsule or on me (in a carrier), putting him in a bouncer for 20 mins after a feed rather than straight into his cot, infacol to help get wind up (trapped wind just adds to the pain!) and eventually zantac.
Gaviscon won't really "fix" the problem but it helps the milk and acid stay down. Meds like zantac or ranitidine stop (reduce?) the acid production itself so they're not getting the burn when they bring up milk.
Did you have a look at the Crying Over Spilt Milk site? I found it REALLY helpful It was like they were talking about me and Callum lol.
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SJ
Callum - Dec 2008
Daniel - Oct 2010
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SarahJane
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Posted: 18 November 2009 at 3:46pm |
Who is the everyone that says that gav is bad?
If it works for your baby to keep the acid in the tummy instead of in the oesophagus, then it isn't bad, it is good! It is no different than the cornflour thickening the gravy.
Yip it could easily fix itself, some mums find it gets better at 3 months, others at 6 months, others once bubs is sitting , others once on solids. No one size fits all answer.
Have you been prescribed the losec suspension? Read here.... very important info http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz/MedicalTreatment/Omeprazolesuspension.pdf
You haven't said if you eat lots of dairy...
Edited by SarahJane
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emz
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Posted: 19 November 2009 at 10:07pm |
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Re the paed comment, no a GP can easily prescribe losec or ranitidine (zantac), you don't have to go to a paed. So if 2-3 weeks down the track the gaviscon isn't cutting it, or he starts getting worse (as I said they can do that after about 2 weeks), then go back and demand it (ranitidine is a bit less potent than losec so they should start you on ranitidine, but for some reason lots of people go straight to losec).
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AandCsmum
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Posted: 19 November 2009 at 10:54pm |
I have found a brillant website tonight Reflux website
I think that it might have just given me answers to why Cooper turns blue.
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Kel
A = 01.02.04 & C = 16.01.09 & G = 30.03.12
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Joscia
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 9:35am |
 SarahJane wrote:
Who is the everyone that says that gav is bad?
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My DS was on Gaviscon for a week before going on to Omaperazole. My GP told me when she prescribed it that they are now trying to shorten courses of it, as a recent study has shown a link between Gaviscon and kidney stones later in life.
Plus it's high in sodium.
The omaperazole has worked a treat for DS though. He has been on it since 4 weeks (He's nearly 6 months now) We give him 1/2 a capsule per day in BM - which apparently is more effective than the suspension.
TBH, it was a bit of a PITA trying to get it into him when he was so wee - he'd scream his lungs out - but now he grabs for the spoon and guzzles it back...
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SarahJane
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 12:33pm |
Joscia wrote:
SarahJane wrote:
Who is the everyone that says that gav is bad?
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My DS was on Gaviscon for a week before going on to Omaperazole. My GP told me when she prescribed it that they are now trying to shorten courses of it, as a recent study has shown a link between Gaviscon and kidney stones later in life.
Plus it's high in sodium.
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This is a sensible site explaining about gaviscon. http://www.babyreflux.co.uk/knowledge/questions/39/Infant+Gaviscon
If you have a baby like mine that screamed with reflux, and was on gav and losec and ranitidine all at the same time, gav was a very important part of the medicine mix. So yes gav can still be a useful medicine, providing you follow the advice of your gp.
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SarahJane
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 12:37pm |
Joscia wrote:
The omaperazole has worked a treat for DS though. He has been on it since 4 weeks (He's nearly 6 months now) We give him 1/2 a capsule per day in BM - which apparently is more effective than the suspension.
TBH, it was a bit of a PITA trying to get it into him when he was so wee - he'd scream his lungs out - but now he grabs for the spoon and guzzles it back...
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Just so you know, the recommendation is that you gve the losec granules 30 min away from milk, as the milk decreases the effectiveness (to do with the enteric coating on the granules which protects them in the acidic stomach so the drug is released in the alkali intestine).
Obviously what you are doing works well for your child, but others may find the dose more effective if given with pears as explained here: http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz/MedicalTreatment/Omeprazolegranules.pdf
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Berg19
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 2:29pm |
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Thanks for all the help and advice. We have the suspension losec, and it seems to be doing something because he is starting to sleep! Before he would just feed on and on all day, but now we get atleast two sleeps in during the day! Im also giving him Rhuger mix, and have stopped the gaviscon. My doctor rang the paed at the hospital, and he must of said put him on Losec.
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Joscia
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 3:23pm |
SarahJane wrote:
Just so you know, the recommendation is that you gve the losec granules 30 min away from milk, as the milk decreases the effectiveness (to do with the enteric coating on the granules which protects them in the acidic stomach so the drug is released in the alkali intestine).
Obviously what you are doing works well for your child, but others may find the dose more effective if given with pears as explained here: http://www.cryingoverspiltmilk.co.nz/MedicalTreatment/Omeprazolegranules.pdf |
Wow - that's interesting. I'm surprised that my GP didn't mention any of that when giving the prescription. (Actually, no, I'm not that surprised - they have a tendency to be a wee bit slack there...)
Basically all they said was - 'mix half a capsule in BM and give it once a day'. I might give the pear thing a go...
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Hope
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Posted: 20 November 2009 at 7:19pm |
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"Re the paed comment, no a GP can easily prescribe losec or ranitidine (zantac), you don't have to go to a paed."
In my case my son is tall and heavy for his age and is thriving. In more severe cases of reflux babies have difficulty feeding and fail to gain weight. Because my son is thriving the GP did not feel comfortable prescribing ranitidine or losec as she said that these are strong medications for baby's kidneys to process, that's why we got referred to a paed.
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Gastric Reflux in Newborns
