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denny25 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote denny25 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 January 2009 at 10:18pm
Hey, just sent you a PM. Forgot to say though that her weight is now in the 25th percentile and she is gaining about 300grms per week :)
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 10:22am
Well. First day on the bottle was good. Drank 140ml per feed.

Second and third days were disasters. He would only take 50 - 70ml at a time, and wouldn't take any more or any more frequently. So basically halved his intake.

His behaviour was like that at the breast.

SO CONFUSED now! The Lactation Consultant said this is typical of a baby with bad reflux and has basically begged me to try to continue breastfeeding because, if I can't get more into him with bottles, formula will never help him gain weight as he needs to drink more.

So, am going to see my GP today and get another opinion from him. Perhaps I will try the Domperidone. If my milk supply is increased, and milk is easier to get, perhaps he will increase his intake?

I thought for one day that we might be ok. But his behaviour suggests otherwise. Food must just make him miserable, whatever way it comes out.

He dipped under the 3rd percentile yesterday.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fire_engine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 10:35am
How is his reflux being managed?

ETA: just looked at your Domperidone post. Has Jackson been seen by Paeds? If your LC is convinced it's reflux, then I would think that the issue is more with Jackson (and his sore wee tummy) than you and all the Domeperidone in the world isn't going to help the underlying issue - the reflux. Apologies if you've done this, but I would definitely push for a paeds referral to get his reflux checked and make sure there's nothing else going on that could be contributing to FTT.

Edited by Flissty
Mum to two wee boys
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 10:44am
Omeprazole, via suspension (2.5ml at 2mg per ml, twice a day) at the moment.

I am wondering if we should go to granular, as it is supposed to be better. And perhaps he needs a higher dose? He is already on 10mg per day though and only weighs 5.6kg.

His reflux doesn't seem to upset him at other times, so I am still not convinced it's the root of our feeding issues.

It's so confusing and unknown. If I had straight answers it would be a lot easier.


Edited to clarify doseage.

Edited by kiwilaurie
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fire_engine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fire_engine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 10:50am
That's a reasonable dose, though according to Cryingoverspiltmilk, he can go higher.

Has he been to paeds?

I really feel for you - it's such a hard time when they're not growing but not eating, and you just don't know what the heck is going on
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 10:54am
Yep, been seen by an oncall paed when he was on a 15 hr hunger strike.

He physically checks out fine so noone wants to do any more tests. I am not sure how I feel about that. I kind of wish his gut could be checked in some way, but I don't even know what the option are.

I know if he ate more he'd grow. It's not like he has a healthy appetite but still slow to gain. What is stipping him from wanting to eat? That's the question I need an answer for!
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fire_engine View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fire_engine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 11:01am
I'd go for another referral back to paeds for a clinic appointment where you can go through it all again.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote weegee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 12:31pm
I was just on the Crying Over Spilt Milk website for another reason, and noticed this snippet:
"Babies refusing to breastfeed due to reflux pain may temporarily feed from a bottle, but will eventually also refuse the bottle once they realise that bottle-feeds also lead to the same pain."

So sounds like Fliss may be onto something...?

Mum to JJ, 4 July 2008 & Addie, 28 July 2010
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 12:43pm
Thanks. Hoping GP will feel the same today. There must be some way to get to the bottom of this - it just doens't seem normal.

But I think everyone just thinks I am a neurtoic mother. Which, is possibly partly true!!
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 1:30pm
Fliss, I didn't notice your edited post until I read Weegees comment.

I am still learning about the reflux. Does reflux cause a sore tummy? Cos it is almost like Jackson eats vigorously and then something puts him off as he will abruptly stop.

To me, that would be less about any burning in his throat (which the omeprazole should manage anyway), and more about some feeling of discomfort as the milk hits his tummy.
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Maya View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maya Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 1:59pm
It doesn't cause a sore tummy, but it causes pain in the throat and burning in the oesophagus (sp) so that can interrupt their feeding. Refluxers will often start the feed OK but then realise that they are in pain again and stop feeding.

I agree with Fliss, definitely get a referral to paeds and have him checked. It could be just that he is a small feeder, both gremlins were and ended up FTT but nothing we could do would make them take more, that was just normal for them. But it could also be something else underlying, Maya was also FTT but hers was related to allergies causing gastric bleeding.

I think the bottle/breast decision should be more about what is going to be least stressful and most manageable for you.Tubes, expressing all hours of the day and night and taking meds to help supply must all be pretty stressful. And yes, breastmilk is better for baby, but you've given him nearly 4 months of breastmilk which is more than a lot of women are able to do. Plus, as Flissty said, it's not an all or nothing. What about if you stopped expressing and just breastfed and then topped him up with formula as and when required. In my experience with the gremlins, expressing can be completely soul destroying and all consuming.

Big hugs and best of luck. We all know how hard you have tried and are trying and regardless of what you decide from here on out no one can ever say that you didn't do everything you possibly could in Jackson's best interests.
Maya Grace (28/02/03)
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The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 2:34pm
I know you're right Emma. I think in my heart I know that if the BFing attempt still doesn't work, then I will formula feed. And I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

Except Jackson's ridiculously stubborn refusal to drink formula! I guess he will get there if hungry enough.

The only concern I have with formula feeding is the need to get a greater volume into him than if he were drinking EBM. That's gonna be tricky.

When did the Gremlins start to catch up? They look perfect to me!
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2009 at 6:49pm
I have a referral to the paeds at Wellington Hospital. Which is good.

Doctor really feels that something is not right.

Does anyone know what the wait is like through the Wellington Public system?
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happymumma View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote happymumma Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2009 at 6:37pm
Kiwilaurie I just wanted to say hang in there. It's great that you have a referral - it does sound like a really good start. I'm not sure what the waitlist is I'm afraid but at least you are in the system now.

I also wanted to add my support re the whole BF vs FF issue. I switched to formula at two weeks because Ollie just wasn't having a bar of BF'ing despite working with a great LC etc. He suddenly became a happy, thriving little boy (and I was so much happier too!! I went from feeling like a complete failure as a mum to quite happy). In the end I firmly believe whatever you decide is the right decision.

I see that you live in Wgtn too. If you ever feel the need to offload in person to someone I'm in Wgtn. Just PM me and we can meet up somewhere if you need / want it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maya Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2009 at 12:31am
If he's dipped below the 3rd centile I'd say they'll make it a high priority referral, but I'm not sure what the wait is like in Wellington. Lil miss had a non urgent referral for her heart check and we had to wait about six weeks I think.

The gremlins started to catch up with their weight when they were about 17-18mths but it's really only the last 2 months or so that they have been truly well with no ear infections, colds etc. so we're enjoying having two happy, healthy girls for once instead of two grizzly, sick ones. They eat like horses now too which helps! Tonight they ate a whole pizza between them and Maya followed by a scoop of ice cream and two whole peaches each .

Don't worry about being a neurotic mother, I often feel that way but a doctor once said to me - better a paranoid mother with a well baby than a laid back one with a sick baby - and that stuck in my mind. It's so true. We really do know our babies best.
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KiwiL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KiwiL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2009 at 8:55pm
Thanks for the support Kate and the offer to meet up as well. :) Thanks also Emma for your comments.

I was going to go to the paeds on Friday but my GP, try as he might, couldn't get them to see me. They just said to double his losec and they would try to prioritise his appointment. I was pretty disappointed.

However, a couple of hours later the paediatrician called me and said that she had been thinking that his symptoms sounded more than just normal reflux and wanted us to get the PH Probe done. So we are doing that on Tuesday.

It feels AMAZING to finally have one test being done. I know that whatever the result there will be progress - either it will reveal the severity and we can up the dose, or it will show it's not so bad and they will have to start looking for something else.

Unfortunately it means we are off all reflux meds till then. Eek!!

I really want to go to formula now, but am going to wait till we get some results. Changing over is going to be really hard and without knowing what is going on, may be of no benefit.

Too hard!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pomikiwi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2009 at 9:55pm
Good luck hun hope you get some anwers, must be so stressful for you and Jackson. Heart breaking too that he his in pain :-(

DD-Carys Amelia 17.03.06
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Maya View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Maya Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 January 2009 at 10:14pm
Yay for progress, best of luck with the pH probe and over the next few days while you wait for the pH probe. I hope you get some answers.
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(02/01/06)
The Gremlins:Sienna Marie & Mercedes Kailah (14/10/06)
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Her ladyship:Rosalia Sophie Anais (18/06/12)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote happymumma Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 January 2009 at 2:37pm
Good luck with the PH probe tomorrow - hope it gives you some answers!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shezamumof3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 January 2009 at 2:40pm
Good Luck for tomorrow Laurie, I hope you get some answers **hugs** for you and Jackson.

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